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Post by Rear on Oct 20, 2014 11:58:43 GMT
So I have a horse who is now 4 I've had her since she was 2 , she's never reared under saddle. I took her on the field to ride and she stopped to look at the bushes. I do allow her to stop and look and encourage her to investigate spooky things, however this time she stopped to look and then just went vertical, no warning at all.
What do you do the first time a youngster rears under saddle? I came off to the side and led her until she calmed down and then got back on and she was fine. I've had a horse rear up and flip over on me before and I want avoid that happening again!
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Post by Philippa on Oct 20, 2014 12:05:28 GMT
Hmmmm unfortunately once is too many times for me.
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Post by Rear on Oct 20, 2014 12:14:43 GMT
What would you do?
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Post by ponymum on Oct 20, 2014 12:32:03 GMT
Does all your tack fit? Has she matured and the saddle is pinching?? Get her teeth , back and tack checked and if she does it again , maybe she needs to hack in company for some confidence? I always say rearing is forward movement going up , so maybe you caught her mouth and she felt the only way was to go up? Only a suggestion , not accusing . Worrying though , maybe put a neck strap on to hack out in , so you can hold it if she feels like she is going to go up?
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Post by Rear on Oct 20, 2014 12:51:57 GMT
I've booked in for her teeth , but she had those done 9 months ago. I will have saddle re-checked as well. It's just really odd , I couldn't have caught her mouth as she was literally stood looking at bushes and I was sat letting her, no pressure and then she just went vertical. She's a 17.2 hunter so I don't want to be under her lol!
I will look in to a neck strap I would like to get something to help prevent it as well as I'm scared of being under another that rears and flips x
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Post by ponymum on Oct 20, 2014 12:55:49 GMT
Some horses need their teeth looked at every 6 months x so maybe she had a sharp tooth, I hope it is that , at 17.2 is big when vertical!
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Post by same here on Oct 20, 2014 13:39:18 GMT
agree with Philippa
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smalley
Full Member
Horses lend us the wings we lack
Posts: 419
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Post by smalley on Oct 20, 2014 15:29:41 GMT
possibly a naughty teenage stage? My mare stands on her back legs/twists round (if that makes sense?) as a way of evading going forward, as long as she's going really really forward she can't do it. She went through a period recently of her doing it a lot and I just had to ride her through it, even if it meant we cantered round for an hour until she learns she has to go forward. Since a couple of times of sorting her out like this she's been fine and has gone back to stopping, looking then going once I ask her to which she is what she usually does.
Obviously this is just my horse and I have never felt unsafe when she does it because she doesn't go up much and its more a turn than a rear, so I can't say if this'll work on one that rears properly to the point you think it'll go over
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Post by gillwales on Oct 20, 2014 20:09:10 GMT
use a standing martingale, make certain that people know when you are riding, use a body protector and hard hat
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Post by Philippa on Oct 20, 2014 20:36:31 GMT
You probably don't want to know but when at 10yrs old you come home to be met with YO telling you your mum is in hospital unconscious after a horse flipped over on her it's not pleasant and then the wait for her to come round and finding out she's fractured her skull and suffered severe migraines fortnightly for the next 30 years, really, is it worth keeping a rearer??. Not in my household.
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Post by gillwales on Oct 20, 2014 23:42:25 GMT
I have to agree with you there Philippa, only one thing in my book, cos you cannot sell on
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Post by baileybob on Oct 21, 2014 8:04:19 GMT
I have "owned" two rearers - the first in my late teens, she was a prolific rearer and it was her answer to everything, basically an exaggerated nap - "I don't want to" and went vertical. I fell off her what felt like daily for 3 years and it was miserable. Several professionals tried to help, but I'm afraid I believe once it is in their tool kit it never leaves, she had probably been doing it for years before I got her. I sustained many injuries from that mare (lovely as she was on the ground) and looking back, I was so lucky I wasn't seriously injured or killed because I ended up lay on my back on the main road more than once. I eventually sold her as a brood mare.
The second was on loan, he was difficult from the beginning, broncing mainly, then one day, after 6 months, he went vertical out of the blue - but following a broncing session after some other horses had passed us on the road. I rang his owners that day and he went back 2 days later - I'd sworn I'd never entertain one again, so I didn't.
Both my two did it out of "naughtiness" if you like and both had clearly learnt it as an available option, I think there is a difference in that than a rear out of fright.
I think you have the advantage of knowing this is the first time she has done it under saddle and maybe, before she gets chance to do it again and "learn" it as a response to something she doesn't like, you could seek some help? From someone trusted who will be kind but very firm in sending her forward before she gets chance to think about upwards when she comes across things she doesn't like or isn't sure of.
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Post by ukshowing on Oct 21, 2014 9:21:07 GMT
I think you have the advantage of knowing this is the first time she has done it under saddle and maybe, before she gets chance to do it again and "learn" it as a response to something she doesn't like, you could seek some help? From someone trusted who will be kind but very firm in sending her forward before she gets chance to think about upwards when she comes across things she doesn't like or isn't sure of.
Good advice given here baileybob
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Post by thatboythatgirl on Oct 21, 2014 9:44:32 GMT
I have a 17.2 5 year old hunter who when I got as 3 yr old had been backed and lightly broken, we think they tried to break him he went up due to his size left it. Which made him think oh if I do that I get away with it and don't have do anything I dont want to do, so on que teaching to stnad still teaching to go forward his anser stand on his hind two legs then throw a massive buck in after! He used to do this frequently till he realised that I wasn't getting off and would get a few good cracks off the whip as it was not pain related it was pure stubborn naughtiness and we've almost got it out of him now just the occasional bunny hop as he knows I wont give in
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Post by lisadundee on Oct 21, 2014 11:39:06 GMT
Put her back on the long reins with tack on and a standing martingale and battle it out on the long reins, then get back on board and keep the standing martingale on as it will stop her getting any sort of decent height! Make sure you get her used to the standing martingale on the long reins first as it can affect their balance until they're used to it!
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Post by dizzydora on Oct 21, 2014 12:04:31 GMT
With it being her first time doing it I would say like bailey bob said and get someone who you trust to get on her and send her forward and who if she does do it again will tell her off and make her see that it's not acceptable behaviour to do it. There could be many reasons as to why she did it and I fully understand that you will have a slight mental block with her now and wont want to push her on through it incase she does it again, I have been in your position so that is why its best to get someone else to help you.
One of my ponies went up and over on me and to be honest it was totally our own fault. She always humps her back up when you get in her but we always have the lunge line on her and my mum would hold her and tell her 'no' in a firm voice and it would generally do the trick. This one day we were at her first big show and we put the lunge line through her bit instead of up and over her head like normal as we thought we'd have a little more control, so when I got on and she humped her back up, my mum applied pressure to the lunge and straight up and over she went. We have owned the pony since she was 3 and she is now 11 and that is the only time she has ever reared, she is the most gentle and sweet pony who's mortified if she does anything wrong and we know that it was because we did something different that she reared so totally our own fault.
Since this experience though I'm very cautious of anything that wont go forward and threatens to rear and prefer to put someone else on them who is happy to send them forward and push them so I can see their reactions, and then when I'm happy that its reactions aren't to rear then i'll take back over. I find this works best for me as I don't want it to become a mental block for me.
I have heard that if you smack a rearer under its tummy with a schooling whip it makes them come down and stop it but it's not something I've tried or had to try yet.
Edited to add a very experienced horse person once told me to keep thinking 'forward forward forward' because whilst they're going forward they cant go up so I always have that in my head if im a little unsure.
Good luck though and stay safe whatever you do :-)
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Post by Rear on Oct 21, 2014 12:05:49 GMT
Some good advice here thank you!
I'm not brave enough to do the same as you with your big hunter who had learnt to do it naughtily , I was under a rearer about 2 years ago resulting in broken rib, root canal in my tooth, my front teeth came through my lip and cartalidge/tendon damage to my knee.
So I'm not wanting to chance this again.. The long reigns and martingale sound like a good idea and I might do that..
I just find it confusing as nothing really spooked her, there was no warning and I don't know how ( if I got a professional to help) we would get that reaction again to correct.
I have people saying hit her with a whip between the ears or an egg Ect. But when it happens it's the shock isn't it and by the time you've realised what's happening they're back down, or on their back.
So maybe a double check of back, teeth and saddle and then long reigns and martingale?
X
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Post by lisadundee on Oct 21, 2014 12:45:20 GMT
Some good advice here thank you! I'm not brave enough to do the same as you with your big hunter who had learnt to do it naughtily , I was under a rearer about 2 years ago resulting in broken rib, root canal in my tooth, my front teeth came through my lip and cartalidge/tendon damage to my knee. So I'm not wanting to chance this again.. The long reigns and martingale sound like a good idea and I might do that.. I just find it confusing as nothing really spooked her, there was no warning and I don't know how ( if I got a professional to help) we would get that reaction again to correct. I have people saying hit her with a whip between the ears or an egg Ect. But when it happens it's the shock isn't it and by the time you've realised what's happening they're back down, or on their back. So maybe a double check of back, teeth and saddle and then long reigns and martingale? X Make sure the martingale is tight enough to stop her getting her head up and get the height but obviously not so tight it's uncomfortably holding her head in. I have whacked them between the ears and under the belly before with nappers but I wouldn't recommend this unless you are extremely confident and even you got a confident rider to do it for you it may mean she will then behave for said rider but still know she can get away with it with you so for this reason that's why I think the long reins are a good idea, good luck
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sarahp
Happy to help
Posts: 9,510
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Post by sarahp on Oct 21, 2014 14:15:17 GMT
I have used the hitting the belly trick with a small colt but from on the ground, and with a rope. He'd gone up a couple of times, come down with a foreleg over the lead rope, got loose and decided it was a good trick! I worked a treat, coupled with a growl of NO.
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Post by topsy14 on Oct 21, 2014 15:48:26 GMT
My 16.3 hunter used to do this out of complete naughtiness. Purely if he did not want to do something he would just go up, the only solution was to push him through it. I can well understand your nervousness though (I myself do not like a rearer but I decided I could not give up). Mine seems to have grown out of it now (touch wood) as he soon realised that throwing in a rear wasn't going to get him out of being worked! Hopefully this was a one off for your mare. Good luck!!
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Post by Rear on Oct 21, 2014 17:20:43 GMT
I do feel as though if I knew what would trigger it, and I was prepared with an action so whip between the ears or the belly, then I would be brave enough to do this , I could have some one on the ground and feel confident. However as she's never done it before I couldn't be prepared or trigger it if that makes sense?
I'm worried if she does it again with no warning and before I know it, it's over she's then done it again with out a reaction although if she has a martingale she couldn't?
It never used to bother me before but once this has happened I just thought I was really lucky to escape with out any major injuries and I think I might not be so lucky next time!
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Post by Rear on Oct 21, 2014 17:22:36 GMT
My 2 year old reared up in hand within the first week and got his for leg stuck, I then made him stand on 3 legs and gave him a good telling off and he's never done it again... But he's a gelding and listens.... Bloody argumentative mares!
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foxyt
Full Member
Posts: 204
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Post by foxyt on Oct 21, 2014 18:02:04 GMT
I ve got a 4yr old and just had her teeth done again, the EDT has ticked the 3months box for the next check, she says there is so much change in her mouth at this age that we need to keep on top of any issues, not that we have any. I do sometimes wonder how we managed years ago, as I don't think we ever had a horse dentist out as a child.
Worth getting them checked again, just to be sure.
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dis
Junior Member
Posts: 82
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Post by dis on Oct 21, 2014 20:09:44 GMT
Chances are she wont do it again....it could have been an insect flying up her nose or anything. One of mine went vertical fir no apparent reason when we got home I found a squished wasp in her arm pit. do tack, teeth, back checks before getting on again, sounds like she just had a scare from the bushes.... id do de spooking work too.
id not consider pts over a single rear.
my oldest mare can rear mostly when she wants to go but is held back. Shes very spritely, very tb and even in her late 20s she can go up if she gets stressed or excited. Shes given me years of competing, hacking and fun.
My 7yrold has gone up a few times, mostly due to getting scared in warm ups as a youngster.
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Post by flee on Oct 21, 2014 20:40:00 GMT
I have a 10 year old who we bred ourselves so I've had him since he was born , broke him , schooled him, know him inside out - he's a bouncy , biddable , good natured little soul who can be cheeky but rarely naughty as such . I was riding him in the menage about 18 months ago when my next door neighbour came over to the fence to have a chat .I stopped and was stood talking to her for about 5 minutes . The pony was stood quietly until suddenly , out of the blue , he reared up and stayed up for what seemed a good few seconds .I did manage to stay on and I gave him a smack and booted him forward as soon as we landed ( automatic reaction !) but I've absolutely no idea why he did it , whether bored , bitten , spooked or whatever . But he's never done it again - and I do still stop for a chat if I want to ! Give your girl the benefit of the doubt and the chance to redeem herself . And be wary of convincing yourself she'll do it again - it can become a self fulfilling prophecy ! Loads of sound advice from other folks also .
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Post by topsy14 on Oct 22, 2014 8:21:30 GMT
I agree with flee.Try not to convince yourself she is going to do it again, try and put it to the back of your mind for the time being- hopefully it was just a one off and won't become a regular occurence! Horses ey!!
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Post by CarolineNelson on Oct 22, 2014 16:00:12 GMT
So I have a horse who is now 4 I've had her since she was 2 , she's never reared under saddle. I took her on the field to ride and she stopped to look at the bushes. I do allow her to stop and look and encourage her to investigate spooky things, however this time she stopped to look and then just went vertical, no warning at all. What do you do the first time a youngster rears under saddle? I came off to the side and led her until she calmed down and then got back on and she was fine. I've had a horse rear up and flip over on me before and I want avoid that happening again! Dear "Rear" - I've viewed your thread with interest - and have decided that a contribution might help you a bit. However, much of what i'm about to write is in contrast to some of the posts - no offence here, just my experiened views. As a fairly nervous child rider, in my early teens my(highly experienced) Mum bought me an experienced BSJA reg jumping/WHP (an Irish, registered first cross, Arab onto Connemara). A lovely, kindly mare, but with a lot of history. Yes, she had a phenomenal jump, which was my weakest regarding confidence at that point. But (big but) she had a phenomenal rear, as and when it didn't suit her to do something. And it often didn't. To be honest, that purchase was the making of me as an eventual professional rider, trainer and supporter to the hitherto nervous! Mum had splashed out and bought this super pony for me - I wasn't going to give up. We eventually cracked it - not without many tears and tantrums. We did PC, hunter trialled, evented, showed, did WHP classes, competed affilliated junior showjumping (in those days, your one pony did all tasks!) One of my 'compatriots' was a local lad named Johnny Francome - I idolised him - he had a worse rearer than I did! So, moving forwards, my advice would be - providing you have the experience and CONFIDENCE to go back to basics and long rein your mare as has been advised, then do so. Or, locate someone who will. That should stand your mare in good stead. I'd advise, follow my suggestions below. To be honest, I'm not in favour of 'stopping to look' at spooky things, as you've been doing. Just ignore the "thing". Ride - or lead her past any problems, as if "the awful thing" didn't exist. So, if you're not worried, the horse shouldn't be worried, either. It's like crossing a busy road with a scared child. Take the child by the hand. Look both ways, listen and then just do it!! No cars coming? - no worries. Finally, you mentioned (and here I quote "bloody argumentative mares!"). This is why I decided to answer your plea for help. ... Mares are brilliant. Mares are sensitive. Mares are intuitive. Mares only 'argue' if you, the human, argue back. But, treat her with the respect that us ladies deserve - get a mare on-side and she will lie down and die in your honour. Oh - please, avoid the tight standing martingale. Teach her to trust you to go past the 'things. Don't risk breaking this poor mare's neck . . They only start the rearing if they feel 'cornered'. Don't put them in that position in the first place.
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Post by lisadundee on Oct 22, 2014 16:49:16 GMT
So I have a horse who is now 4 I've had her since she was 2 , she's never reared under saddle. I took her on the field to ride and she stopped to look at the bushes. I do allow her to stop and look and encourage her to investigate spooky things, however this time she stopped to look and then just went vertical, no warning at all. What do you do the first time a youngster rears under saddle? I came off to the side and led her until she calmed down and then got back on and she was fine. I've had a horse rear up and flip over on me before and I want avoid that happening again! Dear "Rear" - I've viewed your thread with interest - and have decided that a contribution might help you a bit. However, much of what i'm about to write is in contrast to some of the posts - no offence here, just my experiened views. As a fairly nervous child rider, in my early teens my(highly experienced) Mum bought me an experienced BSJA reg jumping/WHP (an Irish, registered first cross, Arab onto Connemara). A lovely, kindly mare, but with a lot of history. Yes, she had a phenomenal jump, which was my weakest regarding confidence at that point. But (big but) she had a phenomenal rear, as and when it didn't suit her to do something. And it often didn't. To be honest, that purchase was the making of me as an eventual professional rider, trainer and supporter to the hitherto nervous! Mum had splashed out and bought this super pony for me - I wasn't going to give up. We eventually cracked it - not without many tears and tantrums. We did PC, hunter trialled, evented, showed, did WHP classes, competed affilliated junior showjumping (in those days, your one pony did all tasks!) One of my 'compatriots' was a local lad named Johnny Francome - I idolised him - he had a worse rearer than I did! So, moving forwards, my advice would be - providing you have the experience and CONFIDENCE to go back to basics and long rein your mare as has been advised, then do so. Or, locate someone who will. That should stand your mare in good stead. I'd advise, follow my suggestions below. To be honest, I'm not in favour of 'stopping to look' at spooky things, as you've been doing. Just ignore the "thing". Ride - or lead her past any problems, as if "the awful thing" didn't exist. So, if you're not worried, the horse shouldn't be worried, either. It's like crossing a busy road with a scared child. Take the child by the hand. Look both ways, listen and then just do it!! No cars coming? - no worries. Finally, you mentioned (and here I quote "bloody argumentative mares!"). This is why I decided to answer your plea for help. ... Mares are brilliant. Mares are sensitive. Mares are intuitive. Mares only 'argue' if you, the human, argue back. But, treat her with the respect that us ladies deserve - get a mare on-side and she will lie down and die in your honour. Oh - please, avoid the tight standing martingale. Teach her to trust you to go past the 'things. Don't risk breaking this poor mare's neck . . They only start the rearing if they feel 'cornered'. Don't put them in that position in the first place. I did say not to put the standing martingale on too tight so it would be uncomfortable or restricting for her in any way unless she actually rears and then it would come in to affect, I'm not a fan of martingales at all however when faced with numerous rearers In some instances they have worked and in others not, it's trial and error.... I've never heard of a horse breaking its neck from using a standing martingale however I have heard of riders breaking their backs and necks from horses that rear! Each to their own :-)
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Post by pipandflo on Oct 22, 2014 17:19:23 GMT
Here's another not in favour of letting them stop and have a look, keep riding forward , don't look at the scary thing and then ride forward more. Horses going forward are much less likely to perform tricks
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Post by Rear on Oct 22, 2014 21:38:13 GMT
Thanks for your advice guys! Having a rearer constantly must have been hard at a young age.
What I mean by letting her stop and look is - when she was a baby and I walked her out in hand on the roads Ect, if she was spooking at something I would encourage her to go over look and investigate it, see it isn't scary and praise her when she did... Now if something is scary she will go over and investigate rather than side step,snort and try to rush past so it does work. However in this instance pushing her forwards and past the bush may have had a better outcome and I will try this in future. I do however think if you take them away they may think its because it scary , they're flight animals so letting them pass it and pushing them on , maybe trot in a way I feel encourages the flight nature with in them. Having said that if she's decided to react with a rear to a scary object I would rather push her forwards.
Mares are loyal I agree. I've had my older mare 12 years now but have recently purchased a gelding who's a youngster and have to say he is much more relaxed and I find him easier to train.
I agree about not putting her on that situation however I find it hard not to as I ride her on that field all the time and find it strange she did it that day. I'm going to try the long reigning , especially focusing past those bushes.
Out of interest what did the man you idolised do to deal with his rearer.
Thanks again xx
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