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Post by Newlandwelshies on Dec 12, 2014 21:04:22 GMT
Just having a look at an auction whilst passing by today and a welsh section d, 14hh, 6yr old show/working hunter caught my eye. Well presented, well mannered and put together, and ridden nicely outside prior to the auction. Looked it up on the internet and noticed it was listed for 1,750 on local sites. As said wasnt really looking for one and as it was one of the last to go (about 45 lots) i didnt wait around.
Interest got the better of me and i rang the auction centre later on to see if it had sold and it had for 600 guineas. Gobsmacked... Is that really what is happening to the market. Surely if the owner was prepared to take 600, then why have it advertised for 1,750. I for one would have taken alot more interest and am kicking myself now.
Had i been looking at a horse/pony at 1,750 in a local advert i wouldnt have dreamt have offering 600 for it, and that was before the auction fees for selling etc came off, they must have come out with about 550 at the most. Desperate times???
on another sad note, a lovely little mare also put in with lameness to one of the rear legs, reasons unknown, fattened up to a plum pudding (excuse the reference wasnt meant as a joke as very sad) asking for a kind home, surely with meat men around there was only one place she was going?? Cannot people be humane anymore?? Sorry just got to me, rant over...x
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Post by sjw87 on Dec 12, 2014 21:20:39 GMT
I obviously can't comment on the horse in question but often, horses advertised privately who fail a vetting end up at auction in an unwarranted sale hence the much reduced price.
Vettings are so subjective that they could fail one day and then pass with a different vet the next but often people feel like they they have run out of options or they've already given notice at a livery yard presuming it will pass and the failed vetting makes the sale fall through.
As for old or lame horses, I totally agree with you.
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Post by Newlandwelshies on Dec 12, 2014 21:51:13 GMT
thanks sjw87 - cannot remember if warranted or not, but out of interested had a look into it's past and it travelled nearly2.5 - 3hr, certainly out of county, to the auction, yes think there must be more to it in this case and from a seller that has some high level rides. You just never know, but certainly brings alarm bells when such a drop in price, as to why? or as originally interested, are people really in desparate times?? x
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Post by sjw87 on Dec 12, 2014 21:59:43 GMT
Wasn't a scottish seller was it?
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Post by honeypot on Dec 12, 2014 22:27:31 GMT
I think it all depends on what it is and why you need to sell. If you have a nice straightforward anything it will sell if its not over priced. If you have something that has a 'but' its going to take longer and you probably need a come and buy me price, but too cheap and it could put people off. If you have a pony to sell and its in livery, its coming to the most expensive time of the year and taking it to the sales is the quick way out. I have my own land and although I had a buyer for a pony at my asking price, but I decided it wasn't the right home so gave back word but I have no livery bills just hay bills.
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fredaf
Junior Member
Posts: 173
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Post by fredaf on Dec 13, 2014 9:35:28 GMT
Agree Honeypot - if you have to keep at livery on a yard which isn't your own its expensive and sometimes people 'have?!' to sell - i.e. decide they want a bigger horse or the horse they have has a problem they can't resolve. So £600 equals less than a couple of months livery and they can move on! People these days want either a cheap 'project' that they think they can make money out of or a proven HOYs pony! The other problem is that there are a fair number of horses for sale and the nice straightforward one will always sell eventually but maybe not until the potential buyer has been to see six others, bought two of them, struggled to sell them on and then come back six months later because actually the one you had for sale - been there, done that, nicely schooled although more expensive than the 'project' type is the one they should have bought. Unfortunately by then it will have sold and they will be back where they started - requesting photos, info more info, price reductions etc etc. The cost of a foal/yearling is relatively cheap compared with even the cost of a broken four year old - people don't take into account the cost in reaching this age and if you're talking professional breaking and schooling then add between £100 and £200 a week for a very minimum of 6 - 8 weeks and you have the basis for a starter price excluding any cost on the way such as food, vets bills, etc. But there isn't the experience around these days to get to the nicely schooled stage - and a lot of 'producers' are trying to break and school on the back of doing other things often without the time or experience to do so. So the bottom line is there are too many horses for sale at the moment. Some of these aren't worth very much and are way overpriced. This means the straightforward ones appear very expensive and people are reluctant to spend money on them and so waste everyones time including when they discover the horse they didn't buy is now sold and they have to start the search again. A realistic budget will buy a straightforward horse - maybe people should price accordingly and hold the price?
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sarahp
Happy to help
Posts: 9,510
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Post by sarahp on Dec 13, 2014 11:19:45 GMT
I suppose that's what I do, result, ponies still with me! I do have the land to run them on though so not costing me much out at grass. I really won't sell quality stock for nothing - I have put prices down substantially from what they would have been a few years ago but I have my limits. Mind you I'm really bad at selling them myself - can't do photos although my website has all the info' on it but many won't bother to look at it, and I have no riders here to show them off. Currently three As and a small D looking for ridden homes, but I don't "have" to sell them so won't unless the right homes come along.
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Post by Newlandwelshies on Dec 14, 2014 22:38:24 GMT
sjw87 - no from stoke on trent at an auction in york, coming from a place that breeds, shows at a high level etc, either something very wrong, but again would say the pony stood out and rode lovely in the auction, i noticed him being ridden very early on and not at all bothered by the surroundings when ridden. I know there are alot of welsh d's around these days, and i am not an expert on the d's maybe 14hh not big enough etc etc, Either way, would have thought such an establishment would have know the pony's worth and wouldn't have dumped from the advertised 1750 to 600 at auction unless there was a reason, as livery costs certainly wouldnt have been a problem.
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Post by sjw87 on Dec 15, 2014 5:35:40 GMT
messaged you :-)
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Post by anniewrose on Dec 16, 2014 12:28:02 GMT
We have a massive problem in this country with over population of horses at the moment - something drastic needs to be done regarding irresponsible breeding
Since the introduction of passports most owners (including myself)have signed their horse out of the food chain which means it has no value for the meat man - the first thing he does when he attends an auction is go the office to check which horses are not signed out and he will bid on those, the remainder have a very low/zero value indeed.
Until our government sees fit to classify a horse as an agricultural animal instead of a domestic pet, we are going to continue with this problem. Many of you will disagree but i think we desperately need a buoyant meat market so that the old and the lame can have the preferable option of a quick end instead of joining the merry-go-round of dealers and auctions up and down the country in terrible conditions - and yes, some of the good ones will slip through the net which is sad, but at least every animal will have a minimum value just as cattle, sheep and pigs do, plus a good quality animal will then be able to command a decent price.
There are, of course, issues over regulations of treatment within slaughterhouses which must also be addressed but are not insurmountable.
Owners need to take more responsibility for their animals too. If the horse is old or lame for god's sake do the right thing and have it euthanased - yes, it's a hard thing to do and it will cost you some money but at least you know where it is. Giving the horse away as a 'companion to permanent home only' is a cop out. There is no such thing. If i want a companion i can find any number of people locally who will lend me one - i'm not likely to take on somebody else's vet bills instead. These type of adverts attract the unscrupulous dealers who will lie to you, take the horse away, feed it copious amounts of bute and enter it in the auction, even if it only makes £50 profit it's still a profit for them !
Rant over - awaiting backlash xxx
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Post by pipandflo on Dec 16, 2014 15:44:03 GMT
Total agreement from me
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Post by lucynlizzysmum on Dec 16, 2014 20:08:16 GMT
No backlash from me Anniewrose, total agreement
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Post by viking on Dec 16, 2014 21:01:47 GMT
Well said anniewrose.
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Post by danichapel on Dec 18, 2014 11:58:25 GMT
I agree, there is too much undiscerning breeding these days. In the past year 2 very novice girls have come to our yard with mares that turned out to be in foal when they bought them, one, a large sport horse type, was being ridden 10 days before the foal was born, mare gave birth in the field one night, luckily the mare had had a foal before so managed to cope on her own,the owner was away and had no idea at all her horse was in foal, another was a 3yr old mare, a child's first pony, the previous owner did offer to have it back but they decided to keep it. Both were very lovely people, but have little knowledge of horse ownership, let alone having a foal to cope with, both horses were cheap, in the case of the 3 yr old, only a few hundred pounds, both came from a dealer...passed on when condition become known no doubt
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cupcake909
Full Member
www.ninayoungequestrian.com
Posts: 284
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Post by cupcake909 on Dec 18, 2014 23:11:02 GMT
If the horse is reasonably price for what it is and has done they will always sell whatever the economy is like, it helps to have a good few pics and videos
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Post by daisymae on Dec 20, 2014 9:02:13 GMT
The mare in question was taken in as a px nothing wrong with it they just needed the room as they only show coloureds. I nearly bought her for my eldest daughter but was just a little spooky for my nervous daughter
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Post by robrocks on Dec 20, 2014 11:14:43 GMT
If the horse is reasonably price for what it is and has done they will always sell whatever the economy is like, it helps to have a good few pics and videos Cupcake I'm not sure I agree with this other than with the high performing end of each discipline. also,What is a reasonable price is hugely subjective.
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