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Post by trying to buy on Nov 26, 2015 18:46:11 GMT
Do advertisers really want to sell their horses or not? I have responded to ads time and time again, some three or four times, have messaged via HG when advertised on here, phoned both landlines and mobiles , and emailed and still no respone. One was offers I asked what sort of price range they had in mind as My daughter is looking for something to bring on but has a very tight budget and didn't want to waste anybody's time if their expectation was a bus ride out but they just ignored the request. It is so frustrating. Rant over lol!!
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Post by littlebriars on Nov 26, 2015 20:20:44 GMT
Because the market is still down, many buyers think that all they have to do is turn up and view, offer half the asking price and then hey-presto they have a quality pony for peanuts..... The price they normally want to pay for a quality pony is equivalent to auction prices - if they want to pay auction prices, then go to a auction .....
You see many a advert for "wanted quality horse / pony - limited budget"
We have about 12 ponies for sale, but that does not mean we are open to insulting offers .... we will accept realistic offers based on the current market and quality of pony .......
Just a rant from a sellers view !!
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Post by pipandwill on Nov 26, 2015 21:03:26 GMT
From a sellers point of view, I think there are more timewasters round this time of year! I had someone come and view my pony for sale, decided she really wanted him, didn't come with a deposit, but insisted they would pay on via bank transfer later that day, we even agreed to include delivery in that price, next day, having not paid deposit, she decides she's not having him anymore! Then, again with the same pony, someone was desperate to swap with me, then decided they couldn't afford the transporter. Then of course you get the insulting offers, the people to ask 10000000 questions then decide the pony wont suit, and then, my personal favourite, expecting that £500 will buy them a pony with a bsja record upto 1m, been on pc teams, done pc camp, older than 7, younger than 10, gelding, not grey, snaffle mouthed, hunted, can do a moonwalk, will carry nan, dad, all children and mother and s**t out gold.
Rant over!
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Post by jimjim on Nov 26, 2015 21:24:22 GMT
Now that's funny!
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Post by Seller on Nov 26, 2015 21:50:04 GMT
It's always a fraught process from either side of the fence.
I sold a pony recently for the first time in a long time and was slightly taken by surprise at the way that buyers want to do everything electronically these days - email, text, youtube videos, etc. I had to get up to speed pretty quickly. I am very much of a mind that there is no such thing as time-wasting, either from buyers or sellers, it's just all part of the process of finding a right match and sometimes that can mean that you do have to put in an extraordinary amount of time, and I am very conscious of the fact that it is, or should be, a two-way process. One of the things that I found difficult as a seller when responding to emails in particular was that buyers had a lot of questions to ask but didn't say much, if anything, about themselves and what they were looking for, so it felt to me as though I was firing off information in to the dark. Some people emailed lots and lots of times with separate questions that could more easily have been covered in a phone call, and a few people emailed, texted, and FB'd the same questions at the same time, with the result that I was completely overwhelmed and unable to keep track. And then people who had emailed or called and who were quite interested started texting without names, sort of assuming that I should know who they were. I am a pretty organised person with a desk job, and I hate to think how I'd have managed it all if I worked outside on a yard all day. I literally had over a hundred separate communications, and as many as 30 from one person.
As it was, the pony sold quickly at a good price, but this meant that at short notice I had to cancel appointments made by other people. In all cases people were absolutely furious with me, which was understandable but still quite upsetting. Again, I think that is a manifestation of the fact that buyers seem to be under the impression that nothing is selling and that they can take their time and are possibly the only interested party and that if they want the pony it's more or less theirs unless they say otherwise.
To get back to the OP's point. I do think it's rude of people not to respond, but it is possible that they are just overwhelmed, that the pony has already sold and they are too busy/disorganised to respond, that they are just not 'digital' even though they have advertised online because that is what everyone does nowadays, or that somehow the enquiry doesn't quite chime with them, or perhaps they are genuinely just a bit hopeless and hapless. In the pre-digital age we would have called the only phone in the seller's house in response to an ad in the Pets or Livestock section of the local paper (or the H&H if we were rich) and would sometimes have had a hopeless, partial conversation and then put the phone down and said, "Gosh, they're bonkers!" Whereas nowadays we leave voice messages, texts, emails, PMs, all sorts of communications that land in an unknown space without us having an inkling of whether they are actually received, understood, processed... let alone responded to. It's just a sign of the times.
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Post by Cefn farm Horses on Nov 27, 2015 19:43:14 GMT
The market not down. A good animal will always fetch a good price. Tired of people saying market down look at recent auction prices you see the market is very buoyant.what the problemisp people having some manners and return calls or if you want more information pick up the phone dont text/message. We sell many of an animal without a price advertised,i will not send prices or further detail by text.
We have not had as busy for ages, neither have a number of other people i know. However we tend to focus more on potential top class animals rather than proven with the exception of my daughter's pony that we are selling
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Post by ponymum on Nov 27, 2015 20:03:17 GMT
I am currently selling a pony. I have had many timewasters who want to pay 2k for a quality pony that I have owned for 7 yrs ,and have spent training for 4/5 of those years, with brilliant results. I am sick and tired of people asking for email pics. videos etc.These are included in my advert! You have to sit on a pony to know if you will get on! The other really annoying thing is when people send me there number to call them about my horse! If you are interested in my pony pick up the phone! I'm certainly not going to sell our superstar pony to someone I havent conversed with!
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Post by comanchediva on Nov 28, 2015 10:31:45 GMT
The digital age has definitely made life harder when it comes to buying and selling imo.
You ask for photos but some people me included can't always take a decent photo and at the other end of the scale is the photo collector who has no intention of buying and is usually just downright nosey especially if the pony is reasonably well known.
The days of people actually getting in the car to go and look seem to be gone but people can't seem to fathom that however many photos you look at nothing beats seeing them in the flesh.
We put a deposit to secure a foal unseen this summer but we still got in the car and drove 3 hours each way to go and look at him.
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Post by Time Warp on Nov 30, 2015 15:39:31 GMT
Well I happen to feel that there are many, many time wasters out there. It has made it easier to do so by no costs texts or email/messaging. If I were selling I would put the basic information required to enhance the right buyer. Too many questions I would state the old fashioned way, 'call me to arrange a viewing' if you are genuinely interested as all was stated in my advert. Sadly too many people out there fishing for who you are and nosy horse owners, who like to think they know everything about everyone and every equine.
I have even seen fake adverts selling/loaning/sharing, just reeling in enquirers wanting to know who is looking for this and that and they even go to the sake of posting mocking adverts. Mind you this is more the free/low cost membership websites thankfully.
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Post by foxylady on Dec 1, 2015 10:52:39 GMT
I feel I should just stick up here for the prospective purchaser I know there are alot of very honest sellers out there that only want the right home for there horse or pony but there are also some very dishonest ones as I have learnt over the years and quite often you need to ask lots of questions to find out as much as you can about the horse . I agree the only way to decide about a horse is too see it in the flesh and the adverts that have reasonably good pictures and list the horses achievements etc are helpful .I emailed a person about a horse they have advertised on here no picture or breeding etc asking for just the basic info a picture and breeding as I will know immediately if I want to take it further, to date other than an acknowledgement of my email I have heard nothing and it is too far just to jump in the car without at least seeing a picture .
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sarahp
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Post by sarahp on Dec 1, 2015 11:32:05 GMT
There are good and bad on both sides. When buying I do like to have a chat with the seller, it's much easier to weigh them up on the phone than over the internet.
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Post by silvo on Dec 1, 2015 12:47:07 GMT
We recently sold our very very much loved pony to an absolutely perfect home but we went through countless, sometimes ludicrous, enquiries first. The pony was a small child's first pony, nothing flash but totally safe for kids to handle, a complete poppet and very pretty. She was our child's pony and long since outgrown so we advertised her for sale accurately and completely honestly described as suitable as a first lead rein pony but been a lady of leisure for a significant time. The most crazy enquiries were was she ready to go out jumping bsja and what was she like cross country! I had one woman get really shirty about her actually being a show ready first ridden despite my telling her repeatedly that she wasn't. I had an ex pc district commissioner message me to tell me when she'd be coming to view (not ask and without any previous conversation. 8.30 on a week night? I think not!) and her minion issued me a list of requirements the pony would be expected to meet! I'm afraid they, and anyone else who made no effort to tell me what they offered our beloved pony got the brush off. I didn't respond to the bsj and cross country idiots, it's just pointless. I arranged four viewings. Two it turns out were a pair of friends who were arranging to see the pony but not communicating with each other. I had to plough through two days of endless ridiculous messages before I sorted them out and then they didn't show up! One other was lovely but hadn't actually bothered to tell her husband she was pony shopping so she cancelled when he found out. The last people were perfect. We couldn't have asked for better and our pony now lives in a pony paradise where she is loved by lots of little kids. So yes sellers do want to sell but not to just anyone and not to people with completely odd ideas. The buyers market in my area is awash with people who want everything for nothing and people who seem to know and offer very little. Top notch horses will always sell to good homes for good money but I suspect even those sellers have to plough through the dreamers and the downright odd. I'm not looking forward to selling my horse next year.
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Post by honeypot on Dec 1, 2015 13:28:47 GMT
We recently sold our very very much loved pony to an absolutely perfect home but we went through countless, sometimes ludicrous, enquiries first. The pony was a small child's first pony, nothing flash but totally safe for kids to handle, a complete poppet and very pretty. She was our child's pony and long since outgrown so we advertised her for sale accurately and completely honestly described as suitable as a first lead rein pony but been a lady of leisure for a significant time. The most crazy enquiries were was she ready to go out jumping bsja and what was she like cross country! I had one woman get really shirty about her actually being a show ready first ridden despite my telling her repeatedly that she wasn't. I had an ex pc district commissioner message me to tell me when she'd be coming to view (not ask and without any previous conversation. 8.30 on a week night? I think not!) and her minion issued me a list of requirements the pony would be expected to meet! I'm afraid they, and anyone else who made no effort to tell me what they offered our beloved pony got the brush off. I didn't respond to the bsj and cross country idiots, it's just pointless. I arranged four viewings. Two it turns out were a pair of friends who were arranging to see the pony but not communicating with each other. I had to plough through two days of endless ridiculous messages before I sorted them out and then they didn't show up! One other was lovely but hadn't actually bothered to tell her husband she was pony shopping so she cancelled when he found out. The last people were perfect. We couldn't have asked for better and our pony now lives in a pony paradise where she is loved by lots of little kids. So yes sellers do want to sell but not to just anyone and not to people with completely odd ideas. The buyers market in my area is awash with people who want everything for nothing and people who seem to know and offer very little. Top notch horses will always sell to good homes for good money but I suspect even those sellers have to plough through the dreamers and the downright odd. I'm not looking forward to selling my horse next year. I think this describes my attitude to it all. I do not sell very often and far more important than any money is the person I am selling to. I used to loan out a PC schoolmaster who in his day was worth a lot of money. The amount of people who wanted a picture even though he was less than five miles away or when they came wanted to ride the socks off him, 'will he jump over 3ft ?', they didn't get the fact it was they who had to pass the test. I have bought a few using the internet, most of what I go and look at I buy, just from a photo no video. A 10 min phone call is all it takes, saves a lot of hassle.
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Post by ponymum on Dec 2, 2015 8:37:45 GMT
Since this thread has been running , I have had 2 enquiries about my pony - both times I have supplied my phone number - Guess what? No phonecalls!!!! I am really getting to the end of my tether with "purchasers" or not as the case seems to be!
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Post by polroger on Dec 2, 2015 13:44:26 GMT
Do I want to sell - YES! I have a super quality 133 SHP for sale, 3 yr old, outstanding movement and plenty of bone. I've had few calls, one I really did hope was going to lead to him being sold, but the buyers being at one end of the Country, and me at the other it was just not going to happen. I had one clown, who refused to speak to me, I even rang them, but my calls were cut off - who had the audacity to offer me half the asking price. I said what I would be prepared to take, but all went quiet. I can see he will now be with me next year, I am too heavy to break him, but will have to do something pro-active before advertising him again next season. I rarely sell anything, but I do seem to find these days you are expected to jump through hoops whilst the prospective purchasers sit there and do very little.
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Post by Stillforsale on Dec 2, 2015 18:01:55 GMT
I too have ponies for sale and feel there are now far too many people who think a pony is a 'disposable' item. The lack of knowledge and horsemanship means people expect a perfectly schooled paragon with a BSJA or BSPS record for peanuts because the market is slow, BUT the market for this type of animal is not slow because they are few and far between. The cost of a pony should take into account the costs of reaching the stage in its life it is at. Years ago there was a formula used to work out a basic cost - then add on breaking and schooling plus all the essentials such as farrier and vet and we'll be reaching a stage in the not to distant future when there won't be any quality ponies around because people will have stopped breeding. I also no longer send endless photo's and videos - I will send a couple of decent photos and after that if someone is interested I expect them to get in a car, on a train or even a plane and come and view. That way you'll sort out the genuine people from the photo collectors. If I'm buying and really like a pony which is a long way away I may consider buying unseen but would usually find a contact who knows the pony/seller. There also seems to be a misguided intention by some to offer half the price due to the market - maybe we need to disarm people of the myth that the market is poor for top quality animals!
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Post by waspblue on Dec 2, 2015 22:38:42 GMT
I'd like to buy Valegro for £2k....wonder if I should text Charlotte with an offer haha!!!
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Post by Toaster on Dec 2, 2015 22:57:39 GMT
many of us will remember when people were willing to make a journey of several hours to see a pony based on a three line advert (with no pic) in Horse and Hound
Until most of the equestrian world understand that its not entirely normal to buy equines off facebook groups via message or text (whatever happened to picking up a phone?) or 'rescue' a pony from the sales for a few pounds, stick their new acquisition on a 'livery yard' with a teenage yard owner who takes it upon themselves to impart their suspect knowledge regarding groundwork and management, keep youngsters in for months on end because there are too many ponies for the land because no one thinks livery should cost more than £10 a week I fear that things will not improve.
Its a very very sad state of affairs
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sarahp
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Post by sarahp on Dec 2, 2015 23:03:52 GMT
Very odd here - I've sold now 5 ponies this year where people have come to me, plus two enquiries I couldn't help with, but as for those actually advertised - one sold but I have two lovely broken and going ponies advertised that no-one seems to want. These two need to go on and find homes, but the others came off my list of "to be sold at some point but no hurry atm".
It seems you just can't tell - some of mine went through a personal connection/recommendation, others to people I don't have any connection with at all.
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Post by connemara5 on Dec 3, 2015 9:29:17 GMT
I have a lovely pony for sale on here - I have had loads of calls some of which are quite odd to say the least ! I have been very honest as the home is paramount to us. I thought this would be a good thing as no pony is perfect and we have been sold a wrong one in the past. I really don't know what some people want - it is being advertised as having done Showing, Dressage, Jumping so why would they ask if it would gymkhana !!! Our Instructor has told us to take him off the market as he is to cheap anyway.
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sarahp
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Post by sarahp on Dec 3, 2015 9:51:55 GMT
I know how you feel connemara5, I have two riddens for sale on here, no comment or pm to me at all although phone number of the girl who has them at present is given so I don't know if any calls have gone to her. They do need new homes as I as breeder have no use for them, and priced to sell but I too wonder if their low prices are putting people off, it's so difficult to know where to pitch it, maybe if I asked three times as much they'd go! I think it will be the last time I have something broken to help sell it though, buyers can do their own breaking, or arrange for it to be done, in future. I would have given my eye teeth for either of these ponies if I'd been looking for them when my daughter was young, if that makes sense!
Odd calls aren't new though - years ago pre-internet I put up a wanted ad for an Open PC event schoolmaster for my daughter, and got offered the most extraordinary selection. I took to asking if it was OK for a wimpy middle-aged mother with a bad back to hack out alone (that's if I hadn't already disregarded it on grounds of never having been XC, or having just weaned a foal or something of the sort) and could often tell from the reaction, if not from what was actually said, if it might be suitable. I did sometimes get an honourable person who just said that what they were selling wouldn't fit our bill, for which I was profoundly grateful, thanked them and asked no more. Two that we actually went to see come to mind - one that reared in its own home arena, and another who did a dirty stop, dropped its shoulder and dumped daughter onto a tiny cross pole. I always hated buying riddens - breeding stock, although not without its pooh traps, is much easier.
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Post by stllforsale on Dec 3, 2015 9:55:35 GMT
Connemara5 I think you're correct in suggesting that your price is too cheap - although I don't know how much you are asking! People need to understand the outlay and ongoing costs of keeping a pony and as Toaster has said until the FB crowd realise that it costs more than £10 a week to keep on a livery yard run by a "Qualified i.e. level 1 or 2 NVQ" things aren't really going to improve. Yes there are some genuine people advertising on FB but its far to easy to send off a 'random' message asking for details with absolutely no intent other than a passing whim!
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Post by stillforsale on Dec 3, 2015 10:08:44 GMT
Sarahp I do so agree with you re the cost of sending home bred ponies to be broken. Over the past two years I must have spent a minimum of £1500 and probably nearer £2000 on having ponies professionally broken - that's per pony not for all of them, and then the people want them back to do more!! Unless you are able to personally supervise the breaking and care of your animals when they are away it's simply not worth sending them to be broken. Without exception mine have returned in much poorer condition than when first sent away. One previously broken and going sweetly went to be sold by a well known showing person, eventually they returned the pony - the vet summoned to check the pony was horrified at the state of her mouth, poor pony just stood on the yard and shook, I later found she had most likely been doped! So will I breed any more - sorry not until things improve.
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sarahp
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Post by sarahp on Dec 3, 2015 10:40:36 GMT
I'm lucky enough to have found someone to break for me who I trust absolutely - she had a couple of mine on loan before she started doing anything for money so I knew her well - and does a really first class job. I accept it's not a cheap thing to do, and hoped it work in the long term if they sold more easily to good homes with knowledgable people, but sadly it hasn't worked out like that through no fault of hers. She broke the two I have for sale now amongst others, one I still have and hope may be out on the show circuit next season, and I have total confidence in her knowledge, experience and ability. It's just that it's not anywhere near economic.
I haven't bred any for a few years and have stopped breeding Ds anyway for health reasons although I have a few youngstock left, the 4yo gelding was one sold without advertising (unbroken) for the daughter of a mother who already competes one I bred very successfully at dressage. Now just As, two 3yos staying here and one sold, but I did breed two grey colt foals this year who have just been sold together to someone who has been here and seen them anyway with no thought of buying any. I was planning to geld them and run them on until they sold, luckily I have the grazing to do that, and I do have foals due next year and plans to cover mares in 2016. What happens after that depends on what foals I get and the state of my health. Four of my broodmares are now teenage and I only have one daughter (3yo) from one of them, so they are time limited. I'm always trying to breed daughters at least as good as their dams to keep myself, but anyone who breeds knows that between colts and fillies not as good as you hope it can take a few goes to do that.
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Post by switchblade82 on Dec 3, 2015 20:54:39 GMT
I feel what has happened in society is that people get a pony/horse because you look at rent and it is just same as a riding lesson. Slightly off topic I apologise. Now every Tom, willy and Harry want a pony (lets replace the dog). Fewer places to keep horses in simple basic DIY Stable and Grazing term is evaporating to Livery Yard Status (Expect Expense!!) as well as bit*hing!!
Good ponies/horses will hold there value and it does seem that the market is slowing on breeders thankfully. If I were looking for a pony/horse I would be happy to talk to some of the above posters, who actually care about the long term future of the equine, not just the thanks for your cash Mam, over to you!
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mel b
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Post by mel b on Dec 4, 2015 18:51:11 GMT
From a personal point of view I don't have the time to go on endless journeys up and down the country looking at horses. If I can see a few pics and videos to give me an idea if it's what I'm looking for, if it is we'll make arrangements to view, if it isn't I won't, l know some people might not like providing these but I feel it's better than wasting both the vendors and my time if it's not what I'm after
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sarahp
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Post by sarahp on Dec 5, 2015 7:08:36 GMT
That's fair enough, but some supposed possible buyers want far more than that! I've noticed that many now seem unwilling to travel to see ponies though, if it's not in their area, forget it.
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Post by sageandonionagain on Dec 6, 2015 17:06:32 GMT
I have recently sold my very quality pony. I advertised describing my criteria for the right person for him who could provide the home he deserves and I placed a very fair price on him and that was not cheap. I allowed two people to come try him with a waiting list and I told those not suitable, they were not. I didn't have anyone looking on a budget though and believe you me they would not have received a reply either. Quality ponies are not budget ponies. Anyhow, if you are interested in the outcome, both viewers wanted him and I had to decide between the two and disappoint one as well as those waiting. I did put his saddle up for sale, again at the right price and I had a few very cheeky mails making unreasonable offers. I didn't reply. I sold the saddle at the asking price to the right buyer who was thrilled.
So yes sellers do want to sell but if you are looking to get their beloved pony cheaply, expect no response. Probably much better more polite of the seller.
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sarahp
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Post by sarahp on Dec 6, 2015 17:47:16 GMT
We have discouraged one lot of potential buyers from coming - nice 5yo pony, nothing wrong with her but of course at her age needs more milage, and she's a sensitive, rather than brain dead, sort. Child of potential buyer has been learning at a riding school. "Can she canter?" "No, but she's very good at trotting". Sorry, not for my pony, this child needs an older, more tolerant, been there got the T-shirt one. My concern is the pony, but I couldn't sell her to them for the child's sake either.
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Post by maxandpaddy on Dec 6, 2015 20:47:38 GMT
Its a minefield for buyers and sellers nowadays. Going back 35-40 years ago the overall standard of horses and ponies for sale ( I think ) was far higher
You have to bare in mind the difference between sale/auction prices and private ads back then. Our nearest horse sales when I was growing up was Beeston where you could pick up a pony in the unwarranted for £50 and in the warranted for not a lot more. Compare that with my own first pony, aged 9 a true all rounder, known in the area, bomb proof, nowt flash but hunted/show jumped/evented/dressage/you name it he did it for £350
Ponies with vices, personality quirks, or just down right difficult weren't put up with, they went to the sales and another was bought...sounds harsh and tough but people (in general, not all) didnt throw money away on problem horses and ponies the same as today because the price difference between the two wasnt that different. Because of this you didnt see many horses or ponies with vices or health issues, you didnt see many with behaviour issues, so navigating buying one or selling one was far easier
Nowadays I'm rubbish at selling because I'm almost too honest, and crap at buying because I'm a complete sucker!!
Doomed either way!!
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