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Post by the showing register on Dec 23, 2016 16:13:39 GMT
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jakkibag
Full Member
Urwins Tom Boy
Posts: 201
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Post by jakkibag on Dec 23, 2016 17:15:23 GMT
Interesting news for sure! TSR can you tell me if Coloured ponies will need to be on the TSR Coloured register and will they need a height cert to enter Hoys Quals under TSR thanks.
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Post by the showing register on Dec 23, 2016 17:28:03 GMT
Hi coloured horses and ponies will need a chaps or tgca passport or an overstamp on an identity passport this last for life and is open to non members. To enter the HOYS Qualifiers you can then join TSR for £20 plus £4 vat and if you are in a height restricted class we need your height cert number.
Thats it off you go and good luck !
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Post by silvester on Dec 23, 2016 17:45:58 GMT
So no need to get a chaps Hoys number?
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Post by the showing register on Dec 23, 2016 17:49:03 GMT
As far as I am aware you will not need one. TSR are not asking for one you just become a member and then enter same as every other hoys qualifier.
I should add that when you have the chaps or tcga passport or overstamp you are registered in their stud books as per hoys press release wording. This is a one off thing not annual.
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jakkibag
Full Member
Urwins Tom Boy
Posts: 201
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Post by jakkibag on Dec 23, 2016 18:05:57 GMT
Thanks TSR Will need to wait and see what TGCA require for Hoys entry? Does rather open up a lot of questions about what will be best for the hairy owners.
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Post by the showing register on Dec 23, 2016 18:19:21 GMT
Well if you have a tgca cob they can offer you breed related stuff if you join tsr our membership offers a wide variety of benefits to suit our very varied type of member !
Tgca will need the same passport requirements / height certs and then you will need to be a member.It is the same process for all 3 societies.
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jakkibag
Full Member
Urwins Tom Boy
Posts: 201
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Post by jakkibag on Dec 23, 2016 19:08:00 GMT
Not quite, most of us will have rejoined chaps already ( due to membership dates ) and paid the extra £20 for our Hoys card already on top of our memberships, we are already over stamped chaps, tgca and bspa so will have a confusing time trying to work out what's best for champs and competing!
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Post by louisegelly on Dec 26, 2016 20:21:00 GMT
The coloured class is already a difficult class to try and qualifying in especially the NCT not exc 148cm. Is there going to be further splits type/heights?
Thanks Louise
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Post by louisegelly on Dec 28, 2016 16:05:02 GMT
One more question
If I have a horse registered both with chaps and tsr and a rider Is only registered with chaps but has hoys numbers in place are they eligible to ride in a hoys qualifier or does the combination need to be registered with tsr?
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Post by the showing register on Dec 28, 2016 16:42:31 GMT
Hi
It is all changing but if you are a chaps member already for 2017 it is easier to stay that way
Otherwise
1 the horse or pony must in the chaps or tgca studbook 2 become a member of tsr for £26 inc vat and that is all you need to do as we are now accredited 3 There will be no HOYS numbers for 2017 it is going to be the same as the pony classes
Hope this helps
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Post by maxandpaddy on Dec 28, 2016 17:35:06 GMT
i'm so confused ...we havent joined any society YET so im free to choose, we're wanting to stick to our local shows but GY is one of them ahhhhh!!
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Post by the showing register on Dec 28, 2016 17:59:29 GMT
In that case max and paddy you can join tsr as normal and enter the GYS as long as your coloured has a chaps or tgca passport or overstamped you dont need to do anything else.
If it does not ie just an identity passport you will need to send it in to chaps or tgca with a fee for overstamping which is for life.
Please ring or e mail Sarah in the office she is up to speed with it all and can talk you through it.
Good luck
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Post by maxandpaddy on Dec 28, 2016 18:30:45 GMT
He's registered with the BSPA 🤔
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Post by the showing register on Dec 28, 2016 19:50:30 GMT
Ahh ! HOYS are not accepting bspa so if you want to go to GYS you will need to pay for a chaps overstamp it is a simple one off procedure
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Post by watch out! on Dec 30, 2016 0:04:06 GMT
Tsr membership has gone from £20 to £24, now £26 in a short space of time.
I urge everyone to be careful what you choose and try to see what th future of showing may look like.
Does anyone feel TSR is trying to push the other societies out with an aggressive take over of hoys qualifiers?
They claim to have no connection with HOYS but What other new society would be given qualifers at both its shows, when established shows like hambleton and thame are repeatedly denied them. They have also been given that odd training slot at hoys.
How long do you think it will be before we all only have the choice of being tsr members to do any HOYS qualifiers, and I would dare to guess also having to pay an annual horse reg fee too, or at least an additional overstamp?
Do you think the membership fee will still be £26 once they have a monopoly or will it be much much higher?
Are we happy being governed by a society with 1 director and 1 shareholder who get all the profits they make for themselves, (this info is freely available to the public, look at Companies House records), or do we prefer to be governed by societies with a committee of directors who have to make decisions by vote, mostly are unpaid volunteers and voted there by the members, and are companies limited by guarantee, which therefore have no shareholders to profit?
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Post by prediction on Dec 30, 2016 9:04:19 GMT
It was predicted years ago that HOYS (Grandstand Media) would eventually go it alone and of course it is well known that TSR has close connections to GM. Lets be honest GM can do what they want it is their show, they can and do choose judges who are not on relevant panels, they also have total control of where qualifiers are held so the other societies are wary of rocking the boat as they will lose considerable revenue. I think we have to accept that this is the way HOYS will go however we also need to remember that if showing is not just HOYS then we need to support our long standing societies otherwise we will lose them.
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Post by the showing register on Dec 30, 2016 9:13:10 GMT
Hi watch out
It is my mistake it is £24 its gone up from £20 as we have had to register for Vat and the extra is vat unavoidable I am afraid.
It would be good to make some profits so we could plough it back into members benefits but at the low fees we charge this is a distant dream. For your info although we are structured as you quite rightly point out without being a not for profit I think we have opened up showing to a wider audience and given them a say in how things are structured. We always canvas opinion and run debates and surveys. The truth is unless we offered a good product to our members then we would not have any. No one has to join to take part in most things we do. Our judges panel is free no annual membership and it costs money to run our independent judges panel and all the training we are lucky to have this covered by a donation from a firm with no connection to showing ( vested interests) .
The training class at HOYS is very popular over 1200 riders received training at the clinics and 40 every year go onto the pathway. Over 40 riders that have been through the process have qualified for HOYS as an open or sfas in the past 3 years. This must be a good thing for showing ?
I think the opposite to you in that we are not a monopoly ... apart from RIHS membership requirements showing is more open now than ever before with more choice.
I dont expect you to agree but just thought I might put my case !
Gail Chapman
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Post by kateanne0 on Dec 30, 2016 10:45:16 GMT
Very interesting comments, however, if TSR can keep their staffing costs to a minimum it benefits the competitor in not having the additional costs added onto their annual society membership fees.
I think more societies should be getting together, e.g.. BSHA and SHB(GB) so that members can just join one of the societies and be able to enter both RI and HOYS classes. Last year Hunter owners had to join both societies if they wanted to enter RI and HOYS qualifiers.
I'm all for keeping everything simple and having to join less societies would give me more cash in my pocket!
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Post by caroline on Jan 3, 2017 21:40:33 GMT
A LITTLE BIT OF CHAPS UK’S HISTORY
CHAPS UK was founded in 1983 when coloured horses and ponies were generally frowned upon and laughed at by the rest of the equine community. A steady growth and acceptance was achieved by a group of volunteer enthusiasts. CHAPS UK is a DEFRA approved studbook and passport issuing organisation (PIO) and introduced its grading procedure in 1994. CHAPS UK has registered over 20,000 horses and ponies of all types. In 1997 CHAPS UK was privileged to be offered the opportunity by Horse of the Year Show to pull together a format for coloured horses. Initially there were 2 classes split on height; under 15 hands & over 15 hands with none of the current type differential. 1998 was the first year coloured classes were held at 'Wembley'. The sashes that CHAPS UK finalists receive today is because the rosettes that arrived in 1998 were of inferior quality. A hurried visit to the haberdashery stores of Manchester saw a large quantity of ribbon purchased. Marie (Championship Show Secretary), her mum and next door neighbour spent until the early hours of the morning making sashes for all finalists at the inaugural HOYS finals. CHAPS UK was the first to award sashes and now many other societies/sponsors give sashes for their finalists. Since then CHAPS UK has striven to give all types an equal opportunity and eventually succeeded in attaining the extra splits and classes that we have now. This in turn has positively raised the profile of the once ostracised and ignoble traditional and his counterparts. CHAPS UK has represented all of its diverse types and no one is given more credence than another. We would have liked to offer more splits, but unfortunately timetabling has not allowed this to happen in the past.
CHAPS UK is a society with 2 paid staff (Admin and Show Affiliation Secretary). All directors of the board are volunteers, who give their time, commitment & hardworking ethics for the good of the coloured equine community. CHAPS UK is not a "run for profit organisation" but is run by a Board of Directors elected by its members for its members. We offer a two tier membership - showing and non-showing - to cater for all disciplines. Furthermore, CHAPS UK introduced the fee for a HOYS competition card to raise funds towards sponsorship of the finals at HOYS. It was deemed unfair to pass any increase onto every member but only to those that wanted the opportunity to compete in the HOYS qualifiers, thus creating a “self-funded” sponsorship. At present we do not know if we are continuing to pay for the sponsorship in 2017 or not. CHAPS UK, unlike showing societies, doesn’t charge an annual fee for the horse or pony but a single registration for life. CHAPS UK probably gives more back to its members from within its membership fee than other societies: a journal produced 3 times a year with colour sections and pictures, a free calendar as a Christmas gift, free judges’ conference, stand-alone judges’ insurance, discounted horse registrations, performance award scheme. All prices are inclusive of VAT so 20% doesn't even hit our bank.
CHAPS UK runs one of the best Championship Shows in the equine calendar with classes for all: junior, golden oldies, dressage, performance, novice, young equines, restricted, intermediate, amateur home produced, in hand, youngstock, veteran, open, junior bursary, plain classes for CHAPS bred progeny. We give many rugs, plaques, sponsor gifts and a fun filled atmosphere for all ages, types and abilities. CHAPS UK has tried to keep its entry fees as realistic as possible given the overheads involved at its own Championship and Regional Shows and given the benefits is still value for money. CHAPS UK has raised nearly £20,000 for different charities over the years through the ‘fun+games' aspects at the Championship Show.
For a £35.00 membership, £6.00 is taken off for VAT leaving £29. The Journal costs approx. £12.00-£15.00 leaving £17 to run the society: pay wages, insurances, produce all printed matter, calendar, schedules, qualifier cards, adverts, etc. Our horse registration/over stamp and passports are one of the cheapest available
"CHAPS UK is a members' society run for the benefit of all: it is not a for profit organisation, but is bound by EU/DEFRA legislation as a recognised studbook, ethically and openly run, being proud to be deemed as a "listening" society that hopes to continue with the support of our members, new and old"
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Post by caroline on Jan 7, 2017 15:14:41 GMT
CHAPS(UK) ANNOUNCEMENT The CHAPS(UK) Board of Directors have been monitoring the mood of both our members and non-members since the announcement from Grandstand Media that the Coloured HOYS qualifiers and finals are to be opened to TSR and TGCA. As our dear members that have already supported us by re-joining for the 2017 season could not have been notified beforehand, and indeed all of our renewal forms had already been printed and circulated, we have now drawn up the following: - CHAPS(UK) will continue to sponsor the Coloured Horse and Pony HOYS finals for 2017. The finals will bear our banner. The qualifiers will state that the finals are entitled “The Coloured Horse & Pony Society (UK) Coloured Horse of the Year”. CHAPS(UK). There will be no financial contribution from TSR nor TGCA towards sponsorship for 2017 - A new membership category is to be introduced IMMEDIATELY for HOYS competitors only. The membership is exactly what it says: this type of membership will have no frills – no journal, no Championship Show qualifier card, no Handbook (to be downloaded from website). No reduced member benefits for horse registrations over stamps etc It is purely for HOYS entry. The price of this membership is levied at £20 across the board, inclusive of VAT at the current rate - For all those that were caught in the interim period between renewing and the Grandstand Media announcement we offer the following choice: o Reimbursement of the £20 HOYS competition number o Reimbursement of the difference between the membership fee you have paid and the new HOYS category fee of £20. Any qualifier card issued MUST be revoked before refund is given, and you will receive no further journals o OR o You can choose to donate any reimbursements into the CHAPS HOYS sponsorship pot We will add the new HOYS category to the on-line membership application form, but anyone using hard copy, please just make clear on the form that this is the category you require. All those that have already paid, please contact Administration in writing to declare the route you wish to choose regarding your reimbursement. So, once again we have listened! We can only apologise for any inconvenience this may have caused, but we were not previously aware of the route the HOYS qualifiers would take. We hope you all understand and look forward to another great season with our coloured equines.
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Post by the showing register on Jan 7, 2017 18:26:33 GMT
Fantastic news CHAPS very good for exhibitors lowering costs helps everyone
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Post by Colour of Money on Jan 7, 2017 19:24:25 GMT
Tsr membership has gone from £20 to £24, now £26 in a short space of time. I urge everyone to be careful what you choose and try to see what th future of showing may look like. Does anyone feel TSR is trying to push the other societies out with an aggressive take over of hoys qualifiers? They claim to have no connection with HOYS but What other new society would be given qualifers at both its shows, when established shows like hambleton and thame are repeatedly denied them. They have also been given that odd training slot at hoys. How long do you think it will be before we all only have the choice of being tsr members to do any HOYS qualifiers, and I would dare to guess also having to pay an annual horse reg fee too, or at least an additional overstamp? Do you think the membership fee will still be £26 once they have a monopoly or will it be much much higher? Are we happy being governed by a society with 1 director and 1 shareholder who get all the profits they make for themselves, (this info is freely available to the public, look at Companies House records), or do we prefer to be governed by societies with a committee of directors who have to make decisions by vote, mostly are unpaid volunteers and voted there by the members, and are companies limited by guarantee, which therefore have no shareholders to profit? I completely agree, Watch Out. I am really upset by these latest developments and the blatant attempt by TSR to take market share from an established breed society, stud book and showing organisation, that has built up decades of expertise and has championed the cause of horses that were previously considered second rate, to the point where now they are being fought over by this commercially established new set-up. Once before I challenged TSR over their aggressively competitive approach regarding other societies and I was told that it's a free market and that other societies will need to shape up in order to maintain their share or else lose out. While I agree that societies need to remain member-focused and continue to develop, I really don't like that sort of aggressive approach to free market competition, and I don't think it's a climate that the long-established societies with charitable status will take to well. It's an attitude that puts all that the long-established organisations that do so much more than offering HOYS qualifiers, at extreme risk. Unfortunately, competitors are fickle, and none more so than those relatively new to showing who perhaps don't have the experience to realise where this is heading and the potential damage it could do in the long term with regard to our showing traditions, and indeed our breeds and types since most breed societies also rely on income from shows. As though that weren't bad enough, all this is being done off the back of the very society that is being plundered. For example, according to a thread in the Guest area, TSR is aiming to train 100 new judges for these HOYS qualifiers. No disrespect to the knowledge and expertise of those who run TSR, but they are not, as far as I am aware, experts in the coloured horse and pony types, particularly the natives and traditionals. So where is that expertise going to come from? Undoubtedly, it will come from those who ARE experts in the field, senior judges, those with outstanding reputations and excellent knowledge. And where and how exactly have those experts developed that knowledge? Through judging CHAPS classes, through attending CHAPS training and conference sessions, through all the efforts of CHAPS over years and years. We as competitors have only ourselves to blame because we have become so obsessed with HOYS, to the detriment of all the other wonderful shows that we all used to enjoy so much and to the detriment of the wider aims of the charitable breeding and showing organisations.
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Post by Really? on Jan 7, 2017 22:13:21 GMT
Fantastic news CHAPS very good for exhibitors lowering costs helps everyone TSR could you be any more patronising? How do you think the people who have dedicated their lives to CHAPS are feeling as they have to take to social media and defend/explain who they are and what they stand for? I'll be thinking very carefully before I renew my TSR membership this year.
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