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Post by bowditchblobs on Jun 9, 2009 11:51:37 GMT
Ok im not going to start ranting or slagging off judges, but i was warned not to do mixed classes with a non welsh, and i found out why at the week end!!!! Crikey in all six m@m classes every thing non welsh was at the far end of the line, and im on about county animals here, not pigs in the poke!!! Some of the welshies were not very good examples either!!! The poor Shetties you need binoculas to see them!!! One was a lovely stamp as well, i was the highest non welsh, so no it's not total sour grapes, but i didnt bother doing my ridden, there was no point. We did watch it though, welsh welsh welsh!!!! There was connies, highlands etc right at the other end again. Ahh well we did all ask the judges opinion i guess!!!! At least she wasnt asking what the breeds were lol. That is the last affiliated mixed i ever do though, it was very confidence knocking to say the least.  |
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Post by nativeponies on Jun 9, 2009 13:26:30 GMT
oh goody, thats good news, we only have welshes!! only joking, we been beaten by shetties lots of times, think all breeds should have their own class, even within the welshes how do you judge A's against B's? i would rather compete with the C's tbh xx chin up sure lots of judges will like yours and bring them above???xx
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Post by ponymum on Jun 9, 2009 14:06:28 GMT
apart from a B, I would have a connie/h/f/d before any other welsh...so dont be despondant not all judges go for the welshies! xx
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Post by Guestperson on Jun 9, 2009 14:51:55 GMT
I've always found the reverse to be true in over a decade of showing Welshies. In mixed M&M classes the Connies tend to dominate IMO, and sometimes the Fells or Dales.
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Post by nativeponies on Jun 9, 2009 14:57:25 GMT
WE ALSO BEEN THASHED BY DARTIES AND EXMOORS LATELY, WHEN I SAY WE, I MEAN THE WELSHES, SO DO TRY NOT TO BE PUT OFF, sorry just realised capson i always do it my left arm is lazy! xx
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Post by hs on Jun 9, 2009 16:45:08 GMT
I have a NF and I think the problem I have had is that the judges in the mixed classes don't always know what a good NF should look like. My NF is a good example who has been placed highly at the breed show as a youngster but he still gets mistaken for a bad welsh D.
Welshes are very distinctive to pick out and it is unlikely you would get them mistaken for another breed and they move very flashy compared to some of the other breeds so they do tend to look good! I was told by one judge that although I have a lovely old fashioned typey NF he will never beat a good welsh because even if he is spot on for a NF he will not move as well as welsh or have the same prescence.
I almost lost hope but the next show we went to he was 3rd and the only non welsh in the group so it does not always happen. One of the welsh people then complained to the judge when she was giving out the rossettes and the judge said "your pony moves well but up close her conformation is not as good as the NF so that is why you have been placed where you have been placed.
Don't give up one bad experience does not mean that every show will be like that! I have actually won a mixed breeds class on my NF and it was foresters 1st 2nd and 3rd so people might have taken that the wrong way too!.
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Post by bowditchblobs on Jun 9, 2009 19:35:36 GMT
Guest there was a cracking Connie in what would have been my ridden class, i would have had it up top, it was down yon end!!!! Yes i think half of it is Welsh are so "flashy" but some she had up before other breeds were rather suspect!!!! On a good note as i was the highest non welsh i beat a Fell that beat me the other week! She wasnt happy she said hers is never lower than 2nd, oh dear! Gave me a warm glow though!!!
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Post by nativeponies on Jun 9, 2009 19:46:20 GMT
nothing like one of those types of warm glows!! flashy doent always mean the best breed example though, each breed has a way of going of its own x
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Post by Ziggy on Jun 9, 2009 21:27:51 GMT
I have only done a few mixed M&M classes but have to say have beeen pleasantly suprized. Although I do have welshies the classes i did were not dominated by them. In both classes there were some very nice darties and shetlands high up the line. i think if the pony is a good example of it's breed it will always shine regardless of the judges preference, sorry if people think I am wrong.
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Post by sophieandcallum on Jun 9, 2009 21:59:38 GMT
All the mixed classes I've seen, and I've only been in 2 so far myself are dominated by welshies! Although we did get 2 3rds but 1st was a welshie, 2nd was a welshie These were large mixed m&m! and I don't know much about them but they do look flashier. I was pleased with the result though, the judge gave me some lovely comments ;D |
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sarahp
Happy to help
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Post by sarahp on Jun 10, 2009 8:43:42 GMT
In a mixed class (including such as Bs and Cs together) the judge is not judging the ponies against each other, but each pony as an individual against its own breed standard, and the perfect show.
Of course judges are only human, and may find they can "see" different breeds better than others (I don't judge anyway but would have no clue at all about Fells and Dales!), but then they vary within single breeds classes too - the only way round it would be to have robots do the judging! If you stick to ones on a mixed M & M panel they should know their stuff.
My D boy got beaten last year by the most lovely Shetland, the Welsh don't always top the line!
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Post by myhorselizzie on Jun 16, 2009 15:59:22 GMT
opposite at the shows i attend.. usually fells who take top honours!
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Post by bowditchblobs on Jun 16, 2009 19:13:58 GMT
Well i won two mixed classes sunday, beating all welsh [nowt else in them!] the shetlands were all up the far end end though!!!! The judge was rather estastic about my fell, so i guess it is all down to preferance at the end of the day.
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Post by nativeponies on Jun 16, 2009 19:41:34 GMT
yipee!!! WELL DONE!! HOPE YOU'RE FEELING BETTER ABOUT IT ALL NOW THEN!! SORRY, BLOODY CAPS ON AGAIN!, well we were ok at the weekend too, our judge loved the welshes!! lol x well done x
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Post by elliebee on Jun 16, 2009 20:49:08 GMT
I found this with my Shetland at some shows we could not beat the welshies, then at Shetland shows he would stand Champion?  Mind you done Herts county few years ago in hand with him, there were six in the class 4 were black, mine is Piebald the other was Dun. 1234 Black, mine and the dun 5&6th, Guess the judge did not like coloureds, the one that came 2nd moved like a donkey and had a big bit of gunk hanging froom it's eye? ? LOLxx |
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Post by clobo121082 on Jun 17, 2009 10:11:38 GMT
i think in the large breed mixed classes it is usually the fells/highlands/dales that take the top honours. The c's i think have it the hardest being the smallest in the class and being out flashed by the D's often. Guess it comes down to each judge but when i did a silver medal last week all the welsh were at the end regardless of how they went and i even got asked what my boy was! he cld be nothing but a C!
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Post by hollycane on Jun 17, 2009 22:43:26 GMT
what is the point of a mixed M+M class anyway?
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Post by trader on Jun 18, 2009 5:08:32 GMT
I found this with my Shetland at some shows we could not beat the welshies, then at Shetland shows he would stand Champion? Mind you done Herts county few years ago in hand with him, there were six in the class 4 were black, mine is Piebald the other was Dun. 1234 Black, mine and the dun 5&6th, Guess the judge did not like coloureds, the one that came 2nd moved like a donkey and had a big bit of gunk hanging froom it's eye? ? LOLxx I think this is a regular occurance, a friend of mine shows shetlands she has one piebald and one palomino, both do very well at county level, but when shown locally you can guarantee that if there is a black shetland in the class it wins  |
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Post by hs on Jun 18, 2009 10:14:56 GMT
I suppose they are run at shows where the organisers dont think there will be enough of each breed entered to have breed specific classes or to split in to sections. Quite often I have been the only non welsh in a mixed class would not have been worth putting on a class just for me! what is the point of a mixed M+M class anyway? |
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Post by nativeponies on Jun 18, 2009 10:41:04 GMT
i know, look at the first riddens etc, theyre all kinds of breeds, but could not reaaly split them, so may the best example win!!
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Post by bowditchblobs on Jun 18, 2009 14:30:41 GMT
Oh poo my shetlands piebald!!! Lol i'll be down the end ,again blasted creature is still hairy any way, meant to be at the east of england with him sat too. I got asked what my Fell was once, if any one asks again im saying Fresian pmsl.
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Post by nativeponies on Jun 18, 2009 15:07:18 GMT
i'd say section B!!! x
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Post by josie1234 on Jul 10, 2009 19:03:06 GMT
But showing is all on opinion, Personally I would place a good welsh over a shetland. But that is my own opinion.
I am 15 years old and even I could tell a Dales from Fell amd I have only ever shown welsh ponies. I would be very imbaressed if my C was referred to as a newforest, Indeed!!!
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Post by nici on Jul 10, 2009 21:44:32 GMT
But showing is all on opinion, Personally I would place a good welsh over a shetland. But that is my own opinion. I hope, if you ever decide to become a judge, that you could put your prejudice aside and be prepared to judge each pony against its breed standard rather than be influenced by the flashy movement of one breed. |
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Post by ShowPonies&Shetlands on Jul 11, 2009 10:08:48 GMT
well said nici!
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Post by josie1234 on Jul 11, 2009 10:50:42 GMT
Hmm agreed, Thanks for that comment I hope I will do that if I ever do judge.
Thanks
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Post by nici on Jul 11, 2009 21:48:28 GMT
;D ;D ;D
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smee
Junior Member
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Post by smee on Jul 12, 2009 10:31:14 GMT
mixed classes can be a lottery. Try and do your homework on who is judging and their likes. I have great respect for judges that place according to typiness rather than automatically their own breed.
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Post by princessstacie22 on Jul 12, 2009 20:51:56 GMT
apart from a B, I would have a connie/h/f/d before any other welsh...so dont be despondant not all judges go for the welshies! xx But surely a pony/horse should be judged on the example they are making for their partciular breed rather than the preference you have? Ie. I prefer welshies, but if i was judgeing a class where a connermara had better movement, conformation etc and was a better example for that breed than the welsh was, i would place the connemara higher? Does this make sense? |
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Post by nici on Jul 13, 2009 12:05:12 GMT
Well my new little Shettie boy entered his first ever ridden showing class yesterday. It was a Novice M&M Small Breeds class - and he was placed very near the bottom of the line....! Not arguing with the judge though - he was one of the most babyish ponies in the class, but then he's a baby pony, only backed 6 weeks, and not ready to work consistently in an outline yet, especially for my small borrowed 8yo jockey. (My own 5yo jockey isn't ready for big ridden classes yet, she's still pottering in small FR classes.) He was really well behaved though, and not at all fazed by the hustle and bustle of a big crowded championship show, even though it was only his 3rd ever outing. I'm very proud of him - he's becoming the lovely safe and sensible child's all rounder pony I want. Incidentally the other ponies in the class were all Welsh As and Bs - I don't think there were even any Dartmoors there (but memory slightly fuzzy - 5am starts disagree with me!) The Welsh Bs were all pulled in first, followed by most of the As, then my lad with one A below him. I was also interested to see that a good number of the ponies were ridden by adults in the ring. Nothing wrong with adults on the small breeds, but I don't think I've noticed so many ridden by adults in a class before. My lad goes better for the adult rider who backed him, but I want him as a child's pony and am happy that he behaves well enough out and about for a small 8yo to ride with confidence. I'm very proud of him  |
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Mind you done Herts county few years ago in hand with him, there were six in the class 4 were black, mine is Piebald the other was Dun. 1234 Black, mine and the dun 5&6th, Guess the judge did not like coloureds, the one that came 2nd moved like a donkey and had a big bit of gunk hanging froom it's eye?
