GOOD JUDGES/BAD JUDGES WHATS IT ALL ABOUT

[blacknwhite]

IT SEEMS TO ME THAT MORE AND MORE PEOPLE FOLLOW JUDGES AROUND. IT IS REALLY SAD THAT A JUDGE WILL PUT A PONY TOP IF THEY KNOW THE PERSON AND NOT THE PERFORMANCE OF THE RIDER AND PONY, BUT ITS VERY TRUE THEY NEED TO TAKE A LOOK AT THEMSELVES AND BE REALLY HONEST (BUT IN THE SHOWING WORLD I THINK ITS OUT OF THE WINDOW SORRY TO SAY) MY OPINION BUT OTHER OPINIONS WELCOME GOOD LUCK TO ALL THE PEOPLE WHO ORK HARD,PLAY HARD AND ARE NOT UP JUDGES ARSES XXX

[maudie]

Have we not done threads on this subject enough? The season hasnt even started yet, we all have a choice, if your not happy dont do it, I am determined to enjoy and have fun this season,if you dont get the result you think you deserve, there is always another day,sorry but there is far more important things in life

[chloesmum]

There is another side to this, it might seem like some people are 'following' judges but if you know a judge who likes your pony it does make sense to go to that show. On the reverse I can think of several judges for whom our pony is 'not their type' so respecting their opinion it is a waste of our money and time to enter under them.
Really disappointing when it is a championship class but realistically at least we know and can make the decision beforehand and save ourselves the money for another day.

[lucretia]

It may sometimes seem a judge doesnt like your pony but you need to go under them a couple of times at least as it may depend on the other animals in the class -on the day

[flicker]

i have a good judge list thats because they have been good honest judges not afraid of putting a nobody up ther but liking what they see & we definately dont know them.

[mol123]

i have a good judge list also - judges who like nice, well mannered ponies mainly, if a judge has no regard for manners i wont go under them again as this really winds me up! totally agree with chloesmum - why go under a judge you know doesn't like your pony? to spend all that money and time and stand bottom coz your pony isn't that judges 'type' is just silly. also with m and ms some judges prefer certain breeds so there is no point going in a mixed breeds class on a Fell under a judge who only places sec Ds, for example. nothing wrong with knowing what your judges like, saves time and money and is part of the skill of showing in my opinion! a good judge for one person might not be for another, just personal preference after all.

[maudie]

Thats what I meant, I have a list to, so only show under the judges that like my pony, pointless otherwise,and save's being angry at the end of the day, I do expect ALL judges to fall instantly in love with jazz though lol

[agent]

Come on then... so who do you think are the nice judges, that like well mannered ponies etc and who draw a good number of competitors

[snowflake]

I don't mind going under a judge who put's my pony down if it did something wrong however, if you know what judges like your pony go under them. Some people hate a certain judge but, that judge loved our pony. Agent some nice judges are, Janet Bushell ALWAYS goes on manners, Mrs.L.Ravokic ( sorry if incorrec spelling) really nice judge, and have heard that nigel hollings is really nice and fair too, and Julie Templeton is fair as well. Some people may disagree but, these people in the past ahve always been fair and nice in the ring from our experience.

[foster]

you could say that i follow judges but in fact i only enter classes where i dont know the judge at all or a class that has a judge that i know likes my type of pony! no point in throwing good money to but my b in a small breed class when i know the judge likes dartys and shetland is there! xx

[blacknwhite]

I think the point has been missed here, i did not mean that it is wrong to pick judges who you know like your type of pony, i mean the bent judges who will put a pony up coz of the people and not the performace of the rider and pony, how many times ive heard folk say, i will go in and strip or would send someone in who the judge knows, its seems really petty, but when you get to a show and you look around you and think well, that will come first and that second, even if your pony went 20 times better you would never stand where you know you should be. and i know plenty of judges who teach the kids that go in the ring under them , and its all hush hush .
i even know folk that have rang the judge up the evening before the show to let them know they are in there class sad i must say, as they say in this its not what you know its who you know and i have to agree x

[ponymum]

That chesney, is the sad fact of showing, however its not something you can do much about , so I adopt the attitude - if you cant stand the heat get out the kitchen!

[Giddie]

Overall l totally agree with the comments made here . However, I went into a class last season under a judge who l know doesn't like us in general but thought they would like the pony shown under them as it was part of their breeding although not directly bred by them.. The judge told me it was not their type...............!!!

Uhm hard to understand as this pony looked very much the same as the judges youngsters, although my pony could have had a bit more of a backend but she was only a yearling..

I have to accept that in the three time we have shown under this specific judge (with different ponies) we have been placed last of 8, (That same pony came out and won next time under a different judge) We were last of 8 again under "this specific judge" ( again that pony came out under another judge was placed 2nd and got Reserve Champion) then finally the same specific judge placed us 7th of 9 (And low and behold under another judge she won her class) That is what is frustrating the fact that this judge breeds the same type of pony...!!!

I have learnt that it is now best to avoid showing under this judge in the future..However, without feeling precious this judge may well just not like us or my ponies and that is fine. Lifes a bit*h and you can't get on with everyone, so l guess the same can be said for my ponies.............

[snowflake]

This is what people must consider when enetering a showing class under an unknown judge. Everybody has different opinions and no one's opinion is wrong. However, like chesney said, putting someone up you know is not someones opinion but, almost someone doing a favour for them. Some people judging do find it hard when a good friend says " Oh, i'm in a class your judging tommorrow" too put them down. But, what is the point of that person entering when you know your going to win. It's just like winning with no one else in the class or winning a class out of about 10, you'd get more pleasure out of winning out of 10. It is really unfair when these people do that. The whole point of going into a class is not knowing whether your going to win, go near the end of the line, etc. If you know your going too win just order a 1st rossette, what's the point, if not???

[meltedbutter]

giddie, perhas the judge just has a very specific type that he likes, i'm sure if you have not done well under him, it is nothing personal. Sometimes you may think you have similiar ponies, but then when you hear the judge themselves talk, you may discover they are looking at different things

[hollycane]

Chesney as a judge I REALLY object to your use of the word bent. The season hasn't even started yet. If you are so convinced that certain judges are bent or results are suspicious then you have every right to:

question that judge at that show on that day as to their decision;

put your complaint in writing to the society under which they officiate;

that's the right way to do it rather than malicious speculation. Have you ever bothered to do either of those?

From the judges point of view as the years go by, if you are in the horse business it is very hard not to know an awful lot of people, particularly if they choose to show under you time and again. Also every judges decision is an opinion based on what is in front of them on that day.
I have as many people continue to enter classes that I judge when I have never placed their animals well, as have had continued success. It's all about choice.
Have a go yourself and see what a lonely job it can be sometimes.

[Giddie]

melted butter don't you think it is strange that you breed a type that you don't actually like !!!

[poop]

giddie, id call their bluff and get another handler to take your pony if there is a next time with this judge, then you can be sure!

[blacknwhite]

Jan 17, 2010 18:12:46 GMT hollycane said:

Chesney as a judge I REALLY object to your use of the word bent. The season hasn't even started yet. If you are so convinced that certain judges are bent or results are suspicious then you have every right to:

question that judge at that show on that day as to their decision;

put your complaint in writing to the society under which they officiate;

that's the right way to do it rather than malicious speculation. Have you ever bothered to do either of those?

From the judges point of view as the years go by, if you are in the horse business it is very hard not to know an awful lot of people, particularly if they choose to show under you time and again. Also every judges decision is an opinion based on what is in front of them on that day.
I have as many people continue to enter classes that I judge when I have never placed their animals well, as have had continued success. It's all about choice.
Have a go yourself and see what a lonely job it can be sometimes.

[blacknwhite]

sorry i upset you as a judge, i am not saying all judges are like that, but sorry to say some are, and whats the point in complaining as your name would be mud anyway, i dont go round every show to pull judges to bits, its just what i know, ive been with producers and run of the mill showing people, i just feel sorry for the average jo bloggs who goes a show and low and behold you can have a crystal ball and most certainly predict the winner, i had a certain judge who taught my daughter who told me not to tell anyone and then i could go under them at a show , that says it all im afraid to me .
AND YES I AGREE IF YOU CARNT STAND THE HEAT GET OUT OF THE KITCHEN , THIS IS A DICUSSION NOT A SLANGING MATCH
XX

[blacknwhite]

CAN I ALSO AD THAT YOU HAVE TO PAY TO PUT A COMPLAINT IN TO THE SHOW, JUST TO BE TOLD IT WAS MY PREFRENCE. THATS WHY NO ONE DOES IT XX

[bowditchblobs]

Thats just showing at the end of the day, all it is is an equine beauty contest, and one thats based on one persons opinion on one day. Just keep a list and pick and chose who you go under, we all have our favorite judges.

[hs]

Not doing well under a judge would not stop me from going under them again.

I imagine there could be scenarios where you go under one judge and come last - then go under that judge and do really well because you have either improved, your horse or pony has matured or there are different ponies in the class.

[sarahp]

Furball - not a beauty contest, but should be judged on breed type and conformation/action - that means fitness for purpose! Yes just one person's opinion on the day though, nothing is perfect and different people have different scales of what matters more to them.

[ponymum]

Also, a huge point to consider....yes, we all love our ponies dearly, however, that doesnt mean they are the best example of the breed they represent..we also need to be very objective and understand that there is nearly always something out there that could beat you!

[snowflake]

Like ponymum said, if you get beaten it is disappointing but, most times the judge makes the right decision. That's what showings about really, someone has to be down the line and someone up the the top. If your pony does something wrong and wins and, a well behaved pony is down the line ( nothing to do with knowing the judge here) you feel really bad. Most the time it's nice to say to that person, ` oh, i thought you should of won there, well done, hey ho that's showing!` It's not ALL about winning.

[Giddie]

Why when the title of this thread is GOOD JUDGES/BAD JUDGES WHATS IT ALL ABOUT does this always have to turn into some arguement/ discussion about winning and losing.. We all know it is one person's opinion on the day, we all know that we have to lose as well as win sometimes, we all know that every pony has faults, we all know that we can be beaten at anytime in the ring...and we certainly all know that showing is NOT about winning all the time.

What people fail to see and usually admit is that there are some bias , corrupt judges out there but...Thank goodness in my opinion they are few and far between now and l believe most judging is fair, open and honest. When so called favouritism is shown to a friend or face..the judge will say it is because they have the best pony (Which l hate to admit they usually are, and are usually shown off the best).

Surely if a judge is putting the same pony in the same position first....... that is showing consistency...

I also think that we as competitors tend to forget that there are so many judges outside the ring that when a judge is being corrupt in placing friends and faces the only people they are cheating is themselves and the people winning the class. Horsey people are very astute to this

Sure l have been in a situation where l thought l should have won a class and could so obviously see the faults in the pony that won. Off course l ask myself if l can see that why can't a judge see that...I can also see the faults that my ponies have and l can also say what faults are more acceptable to me but l am sure that not everyone would agree, therefore the judge should have this same acknowledgement..

[joules]

Giddie,I totally agree with what you have said,I could not have put it better,good luck for 2010 hope you do well.

[minti]

Just how much knowledge do some of the judges have? i I have to question some of the older judges who seem to believe that judging for a number of years gives them knowledge and a certain arrogance,some have no idea of even basic cofirmation only a flashy moving pony will do. I am a strong believer in bringing in the up and coming judges who have had to prove themselves often having shown from an early age, done the young judges and sat before a far stronger panel of judges to get onto the panel than previous judges. Oh for a breath of fresh air with young minds who can actually remember who has done what in their class. How about a retirement age or an annual m.o.t.

[dawnie]

Another point to consider, it is in the interest of the show itself to get a good entry so that that show can continue. If a judge was that facey ... then there would be very few entered and the future of the show would be in question would it not?