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Post by holiday on Feb 13, 2011 8:11:25 GMT
It can make quite a difference to know there is a viable pregnancy there if you have paid out a large stud fee and dependant on the stallion terms, however yes I agree if it is your own stallion and mares there is maybe no point, but at that point if the second scan show empty you can re-cover and hopefully gain a viable pregnancy albeit a later one.
There are happy endings with live twins born which gain huge publicity because they are rare, but this is a very low percentage, many mares will abort twins at around 7ish months and there is a massive chance of total loss of both mares and foals if they carry to term. There are enough risks foaling I personally wouldnt take that one with a mare.
However it is all personal choice and as I said previously I have no issue with mares not being scanned but for me it is important, we lost a very good and special mare last year at foaling with a problem that couldnt have been dealt with even on an operating theatre, if I lost one through twins I would feel that was my fault as I could have done something about it.
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Post by stormyskies on Feb 13, 2011 8:40:43 GMT
Interesting. I have my own stallion and mares and I scan to make sure there is a foal there and that not twins. Otherwise how would I know whether to cover again? I can't go off mare coming into season as they show seasons even when in foal, so the scan gives me a positive result. It also gives me a due date so I know when mare going to foal. This way I don't need to be gazing at mare wondering if she is in foal and not being sure and then mare foaling and complications and me not being there as didn't know if she was in foal or when due. Its peace of mind for me. I could never forgive myself if I lost a mare due to twins. There are successful twin births, but as holiday says they are rare.
I guess we all do what works for each of us.
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Post by elmere on Feb 13, 2011 9:52:05 GMT
It can make quite a difference to know there is a viable pregnancy there if you have paid out a large stud fee and dependant on the stallion terms, however yes I agree if it is your own stallion and mares there is maybe no point, but at that point if the second scan show empty you can re-cover and hopefully gain a viable pregnancy albeit a later one. There are happy endings with live twins born which gain huge publicity because they are rare, but this is a very low percentage, many mares will abort twins at around 7ish months and there is a massive chance of total loss of both mares and foals if they carry to term. There are enough risks foaling I personally wouldnt take that one with a mare. However it is all personal choice and as I said previously I have no issue with mares not being scanned but for me it is important, we lost a very good and special mare last year at foaling with a problem that couldnt have been dealt with even on an operating theatre, if I lost one through twins I would feel that was my fault as I could have done something about it. I know that twins carry a big risk, sometimes fatal but I was just saying how nice it was to see a happy ending for once. I suppose there is a point if you've paid a large stud fee, I've never paid one so wouldn't see it that way. And surely you know their due date from when the mare was covered, if she's likely to show in season even when in foal then you take it from the first season just to be sure. Some foal early anyway so really you should be watching out for signs before that date. My older stallion knows when a mare is in foal and doesn't show much interest even when they are sticking their bum in his face. |
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jop
Full Member
east sussex
Posts: 205
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Post by jop on Feb 23, 2011 7:48:47 GMT
i have a mare whos 30 this yr ive owned her 4 yrs ,the previous owner had her 2yrs trying to get her ifoal without success so i thought due to age she was infertile and she was out in field my husbands shire colt well to cut story short i was competing her in hunter trials sj until five wks before she foaled she bagged up and i had her examined internally to confirm she was had a beautiful healthy babe filly
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sarahp
Happy to help
Posts: 9,510
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Post by sarahp on Feb 23, 2011 9:05:30 GMT
I think that natives have a much lower incidence of twinning, probably because they are bred in a more low tech way and so the twinning gene will have evolved out to a large degree, but there is a far higher incidence in TBs, and so maybe ponies with TB blood too, as they are scanned and one of twins pinched out so the gene is retained. I always understood the risk is to the foals and not the mares,and my big equine gynae book gives higher risk of retained afterbirth and breeding difficulties after producing twins but no more risk to the mare than that.
At the end of the day it's a matter of personal choice as many things are!
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Post by bizzylizzie on Feb 23, 2011 10:34:09 GMT
I had a connie mare conceive twins and one was successfully pinched out. The stallion owner had two sets of twins which were picked up too late to pinch but were successfully aborted at an early stage. This means that you often cannot breed them again for that year so i always have the second scan.
Sarahp, i think you are right with regards to the low incidence being related to low tech breeding approach. My mare was not an easy breeder so we were using Chorulon, but only the second year resulted in twins. It cost me another week or so at stud and the extra vet fees as she was scanned again after popping one feotus, to see if the other pregnancy had survived, but saved a lot of worry, potential hassle and heartache for me and the mare.
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sarahp
Happy to help
Posts: 9,510
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Post by sarahp on Feb 23, 2011 12:02:56 GMT
I've had twins picked up on an early scan but one gone naturally by the second, so they can sort it out themselves. I do some AI so obviously they get scanned then, I'm not anti scanning per se (well, I am in the Welsh As, they're a bit small) just too mean to scan when there is no medical or financial (as in needing to reclaim stud fees etc) need!
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Post by gubrach on Feb 23, 2011 18:59:31 GMT
I cover all my mares in hand then tease them again when they should be coming back into season if not in foal, if they do not show a season then I get them scanned and if they do show a season then I cover again. I had one mare which I covered and then she would not go into the stable we use for scanning she took a complete panic attack so we did not scan her but did blood test her and she had a filly the following yr but due to this I will not breed from her again as I would rather have a mare I can scan for piece of mind.
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Post by jump4joy on Feb 23, 2011 23:48:32 GMT
Trying to tell if a mare is in foal by looking at pics..doesnt tell you a lot at all, just a big guessing game!! Unless you have regular contact but looking at your pics she has changed her shape. If she's never had a foal. and she is quite short coupled..depending on what size the potential stallion is [ poor girl not going to be sure who daddy is] then huge possibility she may be in foal....but it's not really about the size but more about the shape...this time of the year they look pear shaped, especially when viewed from behind...i know there are the exceptions...but the rule leans toward shape................you should know her and her normal shape better than anyone....does she look like she's changed shape to you??? Go with your gut instinct...either way sounds like it will be a very loved little foal...good luck!
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Post by jump4joy on Feb 23, 2011 23:53:32 GMT
Just to add on the twins posts....my mare who is due a late foal this year was one of twins....she is unraced but her twin raced and did very well......my mare should have ended up over 16.2 but she only just pushing 15.2 and the other one 16h...............but commercial breeding yes yes yes to scanning...all that time wasted when you can re-cover..a late foal is better than no foal....
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Post by elmere on Feb 24, 2011 0:10:27 GMT
I disagree, I would rather have no foal than a late one and if its getting late in the year then id just wait till the following year but everyones differant.
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ceecee
Junior Member
Posts: 84 
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Post by ceecee on Feb 24, 2011 13:28:54 GMT
Personally i dont think she looks in foal but it is very difficult to tell from a photo. I always scan my mares as many years ago, before scanning was regularly done, we bought a mare who was already 4/5 months pregnant. By the time the mare was at her due date she was absolutely huge. She had carried twins full term. She had the most horrendous labour as one was breech, they were both normal size and both born dead. It was a very traumatic experience for the mare and us and resulted in the mare nearly dieing and a large vet bill. To see two perfect foals dead was so upsetting. We never bred from her again. We sold her as a riding horse and told the new owners all about the twinning. For the sake of about £70 ish i would always have a mare scanned, but thats my personal opinion. A mare owner who used our stallion, never had any of her mares scanned. Her mare twinned, they were born 3 weeks early, the colt was very small, filly normalish size. Both survived and are still alive competing today.
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Post by fox111 on Feb 26, 2011 10:35:05 GMT
My friends mare went almost full term with twins was scaned early on and told there was one!
She had colic symptoms and was given a injection to relax the muscles, turns out she was foaling and was was dying hence the colic symptoms neither survived and the mare was serverley distraught as well as having to be flushed out twice a day.
she wasnt over big didnt looked to be carrying twins they were both a good size ... very sad
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