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Post by Shocked on Mar 18, 2007 13:07:55 GMT
As a spectator at the BSPS area 6 show yesterday I was disgusted and shocked by the treatment a particular 14hh novice working hunter pony was receiving from a well known show producer/rider in the collecting ring infront of everybody whilst the pony's class was in progress. This was not only a disruption to all in the collecting who were trying to warm up but highly inappropriate behaviour to even be taking place. I had only attended the show yesterday to watch an friend's pony compete but I couldn't help but think after seeing this that the time now come whereby the representatives from the societies who have been appointed to ensure the correct conduct on a showground is taking place made themselves visable on a show day to stop events like yesterday occurring again?!
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Post by janpete on Mar 18, 2007 13:35:27 GMT
You didnt mention what did happen for us to understand why you feel so strongly?
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Post by Shocked on Mar 18, 2007 15:27:46 GMT
A working hunter pony was being worked in by a rider/producer whilst the class was in progress and it was receiving far more than the permitted use of the whip. The fences then appeared to far surpass the height of the fences in the course appearing to then stop competitors also competing in the class to jump. This was a novice class and the actions of this particular person was appearing to considerably upset a number of novice and inexperienced ponies/children in the collecting ring....how can this be an appropriate image for a society to portray???The attitude to other riders within the collecting ring and excessive use of the whip certainly was something I would not want to hear of something happening behind closed doors let alone in front of people that could easily be influenced by a professionals conduct. The pony then competed in the class to the astonishment of many.....maybe some rules of conduct need enforcing now and again or am I just naive to modern training methods having left the showing areas some years ago?
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Post by janpete on Mar 18, 2007 16:22:57 GMT
The way i see it is if they put enough practice in at home using kind correct methods whoever it is they wouldnt need to show themselves up and novices need guiding or else easily put off! but yes i agree the societies should pay more attention to whats going on outside off the ring.
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Post by anna on Mar 18, 2007 17:01:47 GMT
I would of thought that it would of been more appropriate that you reported these people if you felt so strongly about it.
I am sure if you had reported it to the secretaries office they would of done something.
Unless people complain via the right channels this incidences will still continue.
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Post by Ditto on Mar 18, 2007 17:09:58 GMT
ditto Gertrude
Did you and others report it ??
If you didnt bother then you can not lay the blame with any societies for promoting such bad treatment of a pony If you didnt report it there is still time for you to write to the relevent show sec & society, if for nothing else it could stop the pony having to go through the same treatment at its next show.
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Post by trisha cook on Mar 18, 2007 21:05:21 GMT
ditto Gertrude Did you and others report it ?? If you didnt bother then you can not lay the blame with any societies for promoting such bad treatment of a pony If you didnt report it there is still time for you to write to the relevent show sec & society, if for nothing else it could stop the pony having to go through the same treatment at its next show. here here, you should not just be writing on this sight, but you should be also writing to the BSPS with a copy to the show secretary, if you write in then you are going in the right direction for something to be done.... please please write in..
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rose
Junior Member
Posts: 142
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Post by rose on Mar 18, 2007 22:37:07 GMT
I would have gone up to them and said something, you dont need to hide behind commitees, just say what you think if they get funny then other people will always join in.
you should always put these ponies first.
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Post by Not logged in yet on Mar 19, 2007 10:04:39 GMT
Out of interest, was the pony placed in the class? Was there no one watching the collecting ring and checking on the height of the fence....or behaviour of the competitors? If you know the name of these people I would contact the BSPS and ask to speak to Mrs Hall. Have a chat to her and explain what you witnessed. I have to say that unless there is someone else to confirm what you witnessed I think it would be unlikely that they would take any action. However, with a few complaints they may feel it appropriate to send a letter to this competitor asking them to moderate their actions in the collecting ring. The worry is, if they treat a pony like this at a show, how do they treat him at home?
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Post by Difficult One on Mar 19, 2007 10:08:31 GMT
I think the problem is similar to something that happened last year - a well known cob/coloured exhibitor/judge was apparently "savagely" beating one of her horses in the collecting ring, and although people "mentioned" it to the organisers, nothing was done as people did not want to run the risk of being blacklisted. It's all well and good saying that people should report these things, but I am sure a lot of other people were aware of what was happening and simply turned a blind eye.
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kilty
Full Member
Posts: 380
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Post by kilty on Mar 19, 2007 10:37:08 GMT
However, as with many issues within the showing world, unless a number of people are willing to take the risk of being 'out of favour' and start reporting incidents like this, nothing will change. Unfortunately complaining on websites/to your friends won't make anything happen.
Perhaps if there were a body of impartial officials that covered all shows and pulled people up on this sort of behaviour.... My thinking being that if they were a mobile unit, not affiliated to any particular society but trained in intervention and risk management etc, it might be more inviting for people to bring complaints to? However with that comes the associated costs of hiring a member (or a few, if it's a large show) for each show, which will probably be reflected in either entry costs or membership fees - which no one wants to see go up.
So you can't have it all ways - either get brave and report it under the current system or be prepared to fork out for an extra service...
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Post by Agree on Mar 19, 2007 12:27:35 GMT
I totally agree Kilty, societies such as the BSJA, BD and BE have stipendary stewards at shows, oftrn just walking round and keeping a check on things such as collecting rings, fences and gadgets so why not showing? If this was to happen possibly there then wouldn't be a need for people to put their neck on the line to complain as incidents would be stopped before they occur...
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Post by manes&muzzles on Mar 19, 2007 14:57:47 GMT
I was at the show and there were Stewards watching the ring as I got asked not to go in the jumping side if I wasn't jumping.
As it has already been said if you want something to be done you should report the said person on the day or put it in writing.
I can't see how you will be black listed for reporting cruelty, I mean if everyone saw it then surely if you all wrote a letter the societies would take note.
People shouldn't be afraid to speak out against these supposedly top class producers otherwise it just seems like one rule for them and another for everyone else.
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Post by overworked on Apr 8, 2007 18:57:23 GMT
I witnessed this at a wpcs event a pony after a class being savagly beaten !!! i bit my tongue to not avoid conflict and reported to the secretary with the competiors number, i doubt anything was done, i will be officiating at 3 shows this year where i am in a psoition of mild authority, i pray people have respect for there animals or i will be forcibilty ejecting cruel people, as per the rules at all events i reserve the right to request people to leav if their behavior is not approproate to animals or people, wish more shows wouldnt turn a blind eye !!
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Post by Why on Apr 8, 2007 19:15:55 GMT
why didnt you say something to them, you need to mention it to people around you and get a bit of support and go up to them and tell them how it is, if they get abusive even better they can then get asked to leave. DONT JUST STAND AND PONTIFICATE GET ON WITH IT!!!!!!!
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Post by interested on Apr 8, 2007 19:22:16 GMT
was this a wpcs show a recent one??
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Post by Overworked on Apr 8, 2007 19:32:06 GMT
Hard to stand and gob off at someone when youhave a pony and children with you, belive me i gave jim a look of total disapproval but i was not willing to start a slanging match or brawl at a wpcs event it wasnt to recent it was last year or year before, not willing to say where but it had come last in its class, also hear of one at a very recent show where by a well known producer went into a stable and chased around a pony with a whip that came out traiumatised but on its toes and went on to be champion, this was word of a close freind, but the things people do for a rosettes, i am happy with my animals first or last they are happy, and not traumatised and lead a useful life. I refuse to lower myself to gobbing off at people directly but investing in a camera phone may be an idea.
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Post by overworked on Apr 8, 2007 19:33:23 GMT
NOT JIM, should say HIM to avoid confuion
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Post by gobbing off on Apr 8, 2007 22:17:16 GMT
YOU dont have to "gob off" as you put it but point out that its not the sort of behaviour you would expect , no point going off to speak to organisers unless they see it there not interested.
sorry but if an animal was being treated like this, one ,should speak up for a helpless animal, not hide behind commitees.
if you are big enough to post such things on a site like this, but not big enough to front it.
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Post by overworked on Apr 9, 2007 5:59:18 GMT
Thats a poor attitude to take to poeple, no wonder people moan about this board when you get snotty replies like that, i was not going cause conflict with my family in tow on a nice day out, why should i, wasnt my place to say anything wasnt my show, i have learnt that you go through the correct channels, for me to start speaking to people about thier behaviour at a show thats nothing to do with me puts me in the wrong, so think what you like, personally i dont care what youthink i did the corect thing at that time, confruntation is not always the answer !!
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Post by tuffchik on Apr 9, 2007 14:23:01 GMT
Well said, your soooo right 'overworked'. Direct confrontation is never the answer, its more than likely that ppl who dont treat animals with respect probably wouldnt respect anyone else either, these ppl are usually bullies themselves and would most certainly start to attack you behind your back. Pls dont feel intimidated by others replies, they are entitled to their opinion, but dont be made to feel all are in agreement with them. Writing to societies to put in a complaint is the correct thing to do with regard to any form of misconduct, whether the offenders are professionals or not. Good luck,
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