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Post by clueless on Jan 10, 2015 10:10:56 GMT
Titch you may just need a top raiser in it to give you more space in front?
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Post by Guestless on Jan 10, 2015 10:12:07 GMT
Yes that's classed as a h2000, the liner in the Fiona is thinner and the headband is a different material so that could make a difference? Although if you get hot the Wellington has hidden ventilation. I've always thought the Wellington harness looks a bit bulkier but I may have a proper look. The Fiona's got the hidden ventilation too .
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Post by welshiegirl on Jan 12, 2015 10:57:22 GMT
My personal opinion is if you've owned a hat that falls into the "blacklist" for less than a year (popular christmas presents!!) you should be able to get some form of compensation or your money back. I have the h2000, professionally fitted but far too warm in summer showing classes, feel too bulky and give headache after a while! I ride at home in my gatehouse conquest, I love this hat- it's the most comfortable, sturdy hat i have owned and i was looking forward to purchasing another one! The hat companys will more than likely bring out similar hats that meet new standards.
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Post by thatboythatgirl on Jan 12, 2015 12:41:02 GMT
Why should they compensate its not there fault! Just because the standards being removed doesnt change the protection the hat gives you! When I got my had fitted I couldn't have a fiona because I have the wrong shape head, and that I was better havig the show jumper xp as it meeta more standards and offers more protection! The new sj xp has alot lower crown than the one the person is wearing in that pic, and is bulky as my mom said It looks like im wearing a bucket on my head!
So I got a patey courne for £700 which now doesn't meet these new standards so makes a 130 for a fiona a reasonable loss (if there ever is reasonable loss)
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Post by welshiegirl on Jan 12, 2015 12:50:47 GMT
the famous bucket hat lol!! Not the hat companies the EU regulations company or whatever, it's their fault and it's not fair on people that have just bought a hat, whether it be£700 or £10!! If i'd of just bought one that met current safety standards to be told the next day before long i wouldn't be able to compete in it, i'd want my money back! After spending £130 on a new hat I couldn't afford to fork out another however many £'s for another, and you can't exactly sell them on because most people wouldn't pay £130 for a hat that doesn't meet standards, most people are buying the fionas etc for the showring or to compete in, fair enough for an at home hat but if you've bought it to compete in you want to be able to! granted you can have the 2015 season, and you're meant to replace your hat yearly- however competing hats are not always worn as often as everyday hats and don't always get as much hammer!
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Post by Toaster on Jan 12, 2015 13:14:51 GMT
Forgive me if this is a silly question but is there a chance some societies may not actually insist on riders wearing specific standard hats? or maybe only insisting on them for junior riders?
have any societies commented on this yet?
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kirky
Full Member
Posts: 238
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Post by kirky on Jan 12, 2015 14:44:07 GMT
I feel sorry for the shops selling these hats as they are going to be left with a lot of stock they can no longer sell and there is nobody out there going to give them a refund either. The implications of these people that could not agree the standard in time is going to have a huge impact on a lot of people.
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Post by Guestless on Jan 12, 2015 15:40:47 GMT
Forgive me if this is a silly question but is there a chance some societies may not actually insist on riders wearing specific standard hats? or maybe only insisting on them for junior riders? have any societies commented on this yet? I think they will already have it covered Toaster, most have loose wording in their rules that says something along the lines of "harnessed hat which complies with current standards"
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Post by roxy93 on Jan 12, 2015 15:42:53 GMT
I feel sorry for the shops selling them as who is going to pay full price now for a hat to only be used for a season seems like they may have a good few stuck with them until then. I advertised my fiona hat yesterday and it was gone straight away so people are still wanting these hats to use for the time being.
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kaya
Junior Member
Posts: 121
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Post by kaya on Jan 12, 2015 15:52:29 GMT
So I got a patey courne for £700 which now doesn't meet these new standards so makes a 130 for a fiona a reasonable loss (if there ever is reasonable loss) Me too & it's not yet been out of its box. Always wanted a Patey & saved up for this for ages. A lot of money for one season. I did have a Fiona, but my head was the wrong shape too.
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Post by thatboythatgirl on Jan 12, 2015 18:17:18 GMT
Forgive me if this is a silly question but is there a chance some societies may not actually insist on riders wearing specific standard hats? or maybe only insisting on them for junior riders? have any societies commented on this yet? SHB GB who brought in the rule about hats meeting current safety standards last year didn't check any last year and have stated they wont be checking and its on the rider to comply
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Post by norwalk on Jan 25, 2015 16:53:21 GMT
It's a total minefield! I have various comments but will try and cut it short(ish!) I still have my h2000sq which does meet pas015, but my daughter (same hat size) looks ridiculous in it cos it's too tall, and yet the lower crown pas hats look too dumpy! I agree that safety is paramount. I also feel that perhaps junior riders should be subject to the more stringent safety rules. As adults, I think we should be able to make our own risk assessments (let's face it, most of us used to ride without hats or with very minimal protection!). BUT rules are rules. If a society dictates a rule then everyone should adhere or be penalised... I remember when the bowlers and patey styles were banned in horse classes there were still HOYS tickets given out to those with traditional headwear, when others had compromised elegance for rules... We should either go one way or the other. I would prefer to use my own discretion depending on how I judge it, but if I'm accepting the rules of a society I expect to follow them. It's going to be a very expensive transition. Even if the bsen hats pass the pas criteria I guess it will only be new sales that are re-branded, your existing hat wouldn't have the right label. Forgive me for waffling, but we all seem to be in the same position of having more questions than answers!
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Post by thatboythatgirl on Feb 20, 2015 12:43:33 GMT
I see the BSPS have finally stated that as of January 2016 Fiona will not be allowed in their classes
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Post by janetbushell on Feb 20, 2015 12:54:39 GMT
thatboythatgirl - a touch harshly phrased
The item was posted on latest news well over a week ago and no doubt after the Council Meeting where the matter was decided.
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Post by ponymum on Feb 20, 2015 13:43:13 GMT
So my h2000 that was not in standard is now back in as of 2016! I will have to dust it off and get it recovered then!!
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Post by Guestless on Feb 20, 2015 16:33:30 GMT
So my h2000 that was not in standard is now back in as of 2016! I will have to dust it off and get it recovered then!! Not sure what you mean by that ponymum - won't it always have been in standard? It's a standard that is being withdrawn but there is no new standard (as yet). I agree about going back to the H2000 though - my current thinking is that I will go back to my SJ2000 I don't actually think most of the show societies will have to make an announcement to bring in a new rule. Many rulebook already say riders need to wear a harnessed hat that complies with current standards - that means those with the EN standard do not comply.
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Post by norwalk on Feb 20, 2015 17:19:56 GMT
A lot of societies have already announced that up after 2015 the new PAS rules will apply, I'm still unsure re horse classes (as new to them and see the rules re bowlers and beagler disregarded in HOYS quals ) as to which societies will adopt the rules and which will leave it to riders discretion....
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Post by catkin on Feb 20, 2015 18:33:26 GMT
Given that time is marching on, it would be good if the manufacturers could let us know what they will have available and when
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Post by shelliewilson on Mar 2, 2015 19:51:36 GMT
So what hat is the next best thing, tried the h2000 on my daughter the other day it looked awful, but don't want to spend over a hundred pound on a hat for one season for it to be worthless and unsellable
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Post by maddiesmum on Mar 2, 2015 20:24:48 GMT
Might need a tin hat on here! But surely, especially for junior riders, it's most important they have an up to standard & the safest hat available? Rather than the sleeker look of the Fiona?? Several other Charles Owen are PAS 015, as is the Just Togs etc
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Post by shelliewilson on Mar 2, 2015 20:58:37 GMT
I do agree safety 1st which is why I have sold my fiona since finding this info out, looking for a replacement that looks a little less dumpy than the h2000 but obviously with the right safety spec, just wondered what everyone else is turning to, did hear somebody mention the gatehouse hickstead was a bit neater looking? Never heard of one just wondering what everyone else has turned to just don't want to be the only one in the ring with an overgrown mushroom on my daughters head if everybody else doesn't, my daughter still in lead rein so I will be close enough anyway
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Post by maddiesmum on Mar 2, 2015 21:13:03 GMT
Don't think the Gatehouse has PAS 015 either, nor does the Champion. Only ones I personally know of are the Charles Owen H2000, Showjumper XP etc and the Just Togs Junior Show Jumper. My daughter currently has the H2000 and looks fine, maybe depends on head shape? And had the just togs when she was tiny as it was lighter in weight for a small head. The Fiona was never an option for us as didn't have the highest standard.
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Post by shelliewilson on Mar 2, 2015 23:47:27 GMT
Thanks it's all very confusing lol, looks like it's the h2000 then x
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Post by roxy93 on Mar 3, 2015 9:42:43 GMT
Thanks it's all very confusing lol, looks like it's the h2000 then x Sent from my GT-I9505 using proboards Have you looked at the charles owen Hampton & Wellington dont know how they look when in front of you but the pictures look like a nice hat, i dont like the h2000 makes me look taller than i am,
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Post by shelliewilson on Mar 3, 2015 11:19:06 GMT
I haven't actually I've always just had a fiona but I will look at them now thanks very much xxx
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Post by roxy93 on Mar 3, 2015 11:23:43 GMT
Yeah i had the fiona sold it then bought the hickstead to find out this is now being banned so on look out but on pics i like the look of the hampton x
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Post by shelliewilson on Mar 3, 2015 11:52:55 GMT
Thanks i just looked I like the look of that too x
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Post by titch on Mar 3, 2015 14:01:17 GMT
Yeah i had the fiona sold it then bought the hickstead to find out this is now being banned so on look out but on pics i like the look of the hampton x I have 3 different coloured hampton hats love them. They are super comfortable and imo look good on ponies. I love my elephant grey one looks like a faded blue one.
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Post by roxy93 on Mar 3, 2015 15:52:04 GMT
Thanks Titch looks like this is going to be my new hat, i like the shape and also hoping they are comfier as i hated my fiona that's why i sold gave me the worst headaches. Will go out soon to see where sells these hats so can try one on.
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Post by shelliewilson on Mar 12, 2015 23:09:52 GMT
Just bought the hampton and yes very happy with it, a little bulkier than the fiona obviously but safety first for my girl so thanks roxy xxx
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