Lessons

[Ziggy]

My daughter has been having lessons from a riding instructor on ponies owned by one of the Mums from school.
She only charges a minimal amount and most of the time my daughter goes weekly. She does enjoy it as it is with all her friends from school.
Now these are not competition ponies but much loved family ponies who like some ponies owned for just hacking etc are not well schooled and have all the tricks in the book! Napping, bucking and by the end of the lesson my daughter legs often ache like mad trying to get pony going forward!!
My husband who normally is not bothered has decided to put his oar in! states they charge too much for lessons on 'nags' (his expression) and he does not want his daughter riding those ponies anymore as he feels she is learning bad habits and her riding is going backwards.
Now I sort of see what he is saying and when I take her I often say instructions from the sidelines like sit up, heels down etc much to the instructors disgust but she tends to concentrate on her friends children who are riding.
I know some people feel that children should be allowed to develop and not be hasseled but I disagree. I don't imagine for one second that any of todays top show riders when they started riding were just left to do thier own thing. The sort of style they have has to be taught.
Although I can't help thinking that some riding, even if she could be picking up bad habits, is better than no riding to build up her confidence. Then we can concentrate on really improving her riding when we get our own pony in September. Or is my husband right is she better off waiting till September
Opinions/views welcome (constructive please!)

[oakley2012]

Can I ask you is the riding instructor BHSAI?

[GinaGeo]

I'd ask myself one question.

Is she enjoying herself?

If the answer is yes then I'd let her continue riding these ponies. These ponies who aren't push button, will teach her to ride. It's one thing sitting and looking pretty on a beautifully schooled pony but another to be able to ride one when it's being naughty.

I learnt at a riding school on naughty ponies, some knocked my confidence but others taught me how to ride. I wasn't always the prettiest of riders but I can sit most things and rarely end up on the floor, I'm not a nervous rider either. I'm currently perfecting the prettiness factor, but the basic position was always there, if it wasn't I ended up on the floor

I always had lessons, but they were with other children and we spent more time playing games, jumping and having fun, with a little position advice. It made ponies fun. I also huunted a lot, it taught me how to stop runaway ponies effectively ;D

Alot of the top show riders started off in discplines other than showing.

[oakley2012]

If the riding instructor is BHSAI then she/he will have insurance against any claim for negligence, but if they are not an Associate then be very very careful. I only say this because I know of someone who taught but did not have insurance, teaching her best friends daughter on her own pony, the child fell off and broke her arm, and the person teaching had 6 years of litigation which cost her tens of thousands to defend herself. You may feel that this is inappropriate to your initial question, but I think that it is a very valid one, as if you feel unhappy for her to be on these ponies, the instructor would have to justify that they are indeed suitable for a novice child to learn on incase of an accident.

[sageandonion]

I think it absolutely vital your child is taught by a qualified, experienced, BHS instructor who has insurance, CBR checks and is required to attend first aid and child protection courses regularly. This will cost more for a lesson, obviously, but a child is not safe in any respect with anyone that does not hold the relevant qualifications and experience.

When you have placed your child with a 'proper' instructor then you should never interfere from the sidelines.

I am one of those mothers who did allow their child to develop their riding and did not hassel and my daughter in her 20s is a much admired rider as a result. I did however, even all those years ago, send her to qualified instructors and mostly in a fun and always safe environment.

I did have the misfortune to be beside a woman at a clinic recently. Very expensive, run by a professional showjumper and it was my daughter, another adult and a little boy on a very big, baby section D. Despite the fact this mother was paying a lot of money she still insisted on calling from the sidelines this and that to her child. Pony ended up bucking and little boy crying. Mother told him to get on with it. It was AWFUL! I asked the woman if she was a showjumper - she didn't ride - well she had many moons ago but had long since stopped.

I leave it for you all to form your own conclusion, but this is a very common scenario and we ought to avoid becoming like that.

[nici]

I think your daughter will be learning an awful lot about riding real ponies at the moment and I would be happy to let her get on with it! Our own ponies are not push button by any stretch of the imagination, and Cerys is a far better rider because of it.

As for insurance, well that will only come into question if you're the sort of person who would sue either the instructor or the ponies' owner should your daughter fall off and hurt themselves. Our own instructor is not BHS qualified, I have no idea what sort of insurance cover she has - the question has not and never will arise. She is a friend who has been very successful with her own ponies and in helping other people with theirs. She has great rapport with the children - they listen to her, respect her, and enjoy their lessons from her. And she's small enough to ride the ponies herself, so she knows all their tricks. I watch all the lessons, usually with camera to hand, but never interfere unless asked to help with something.

If my daughter fell off her own pony I would blame myself, not sue the poor unfortunate instructor!!!

Please Nursey, forget about looking pretty for the show ring, and allow your daughter to have some fun. She will be a much better rider in the long run, and will enjoy riding so much more. And when you do get your own pony, she will be far better equipped to deal with any tricks the pony might have!

[sageandonion]

We never know when we will be forced to make an insurance claim. There have been cases where people have ended up in wheelchairs, permanently mentally or physically disabled and it was caused by an incident which would never have happened if the instructor had been trained and the pony suitable. Even if that is the case, instuctors have insurance to cover such events.

If you are a mother, faced with looking after a disabled child for life and wanting to have the very best equipment etc for that child, then believe you me you will be looking to recover funds from the insurance company.

I think it is better to ride well mannered, well schooled ponies with very good instruction in order to ride well, have confidence and have a good seat. I have ridden horses and ponies that are not schooled, have no rhythm and it isn't a pleasant feeling, darned uncomfortable and sometimes scarey.

If I were to go to a school now to have some lessons on different horses, I would be looking for schoolmasters who can take me further not some humpy, occasionally naughty thing, how can that improve riding.

[armada]

I'm pretty much with nici on this one.
I will just say in response to S&O's final sentence that in my own view, its pretty easy to sit there, looking lovely whilst the horse does everything you ask without a murmour.
However, if it decides not to play ball, throws a leap or buck or worse in at any given time, unless you have ridden a naughty, awkward, not wanting to go forward whatever type horse, you are'nt best equpped to deal with it effectively and quickly.
You see it all the time, frightened kids (understandable) and adults as well, who quite frankly have not the experience to deal with it, and ponies and horses being sold as 'problem' horses when all it is is a 'taking the mick' horse.
I'm glad I got to ride all types as a kid, it gave me 'feel', not just for when an animal is going well and correctly, but also for that slight imperceptable change under me that warns me a storm is brewing.
The saying 'good riders are born not made' holds a lot of water in my book.

[Karen, garrettponies]

Nursey, I would look into taking her to a riding school for lessons where at least you have the knowledge of proper insurance and that she will be given attention. It may cost more but better in the long run for peace of mind. Also a decent instructor wouldn't allow bad habits to be picked up!!

There's nothing wrong with riding tricky ponies, it does make a better rider but on the other hand if she's not learning the basics and your instructor is not picking up on basic position techniques to help her you are wasting your money. Zoe got very disillusioned when she went as the pony she was put on wouldn't go forward so she spent half an hour kicking her little legs off for about four strides of dodgy trot (proper awful thelwell kicks too). She began to think it was something she was doing wrong and got upset and knocked her confidence. They put her on a different pony and she was away again. No way did I want her to just sit there and the pony do the work but I didn't want her to be put off either.

Its a fine balance between learning and working hard at learning and being put off and disillusioned, they have to come away from their lessons feeling they have achieved something and its been fun, thats where confidence comes from. She's not the most confident is she? Whatever you decide just make sure her confidence doesn't take a real bashing.

[nici]

Re insurance - my daughter, my pony, my field - if god forbid she had an accident, how could it be the instructor's fault? I realise it's different if you go to a RS and are put on whatever pony they choose. But not in our case.

Our instructor is fantastic and a d**n sight better than some BHS instructors we've come across in the past. I used to have lessons and my BHS instructor sat on the side and chatted to friends, occasionally shouting out "change the rein from a to c" or something similar. I didn't keep up the lessons for long!

Cerys's instructor has qualified for and ridden her ponies at HOYS and Olympia. She's had ponies all her life, has come up through pony club and has ridden real ponies, not just schoolmasters. She is an excellent communicator and the kids enjoy their lessons with her and learn a lot too. I don't need her to be BHS qualified to know that she's a great teacher - I can see the evidence for myself in the improvements in the girls' riding, and in the ponies' behaviour.

I can see the benefit of sometimes riding a schoolmaster - having changed RS myself when I was having lessons, I rode the most wonderful little cob, who taught me so much, as he always did what I asked for - which wasn't always what I thought I was asking for lol! I aids certainly got more precise riding him ;D I did try to find a RS with a similar schoolmaster pony for Cerys last winter, while our own ponies were having time out, but they're very few and far between in riding schools, especially in pint size versions. Cerys did have a few lessons at a riding school during the winter, with a BHS instructor, but the pony was naughtier than ours (nearly got her off a couple of times putting his head down until the instructor put daisy reins on him) and the instructor too busy with the rest of the class to do much more than call "Shoulders back Cerys" half a dozen times during the lesson...

[Ziggy]

All very valid points, thank you. I think instructor is BHSAI but to be honest I am not entirely sure. How bad is that. Actually thinking about the fact I had not completely considered that has made me feel sick
I think my best bet would truthfully be to wait untill September. I am totally with S&O on this occasion, not always but this time, YES.
For a child who has had her confidence knocked previously, she needs to be on push button pony. If she were more confident then it might be different. I guess, thankfully, children are different.
I see your point too Nici that I should stop stressing about her looking pretty for the show ring and if she were happy to just pootle about the lanes hacking then I would but she is the one who is DESPERATE to show. Honestly she is. It is not me that has pushed her into it. She is fiercly competitive. From a young age she has seen old pictures of ponies I had as a teenager and all my old Rosettes and that is what she wants (Not that I ever won much!!)
She sat on a pony at a Producers yard a while back and even the 5 mins of instruction she had improved her riding. It made her feel very proud of herself.
It will be me taking things slowly over the winter with (hopefully) new pony while she will be 'Can I ride off Lead', 'Can we go to a show', Can I do First Ridden'. While I say 'Slow down child!'.
S&O I only chatter from sidelines as I see her slouching or sticking her heels up at times and Instructor does not say a thing!! Makes me cross! I too sometimes watching ridden pony classes think the parents shouting intructions at child as they trot past must be incredibly distracting for child, especially young children. I always promised myself that if I ever had a child who did showing I would not be one of those parents! (sorry to those that do, for some children perhaps it works)
Guess in general I am so wary. The vision of my then 5 year old flying through the air off our previous loan pony is still VERY clear in my mind and I am determined that scenario will not be repeated.
Thanks all for advice. It was constructive too!!

[nia2311]

The fact you are having to comment from the sidelines, you say the instructor concentrates on other kids, not your daughter I think answers your question.

We have a very local riding school that is not BHS registered. I fooled myself into thinking it would be fine to just keep my son in the saddle to have a few lessons there, with instructors who are probably not BHS registered, or if they are it is only the basic certificate. Anyway, ponies were very variable, ranging from nuts to dead to the leg. He became disillusioned, I constantly whispered things from the sides because they were allowing him to canter with washing lines for reins, feet anywhere etc. I was wasting my money, and I'm afraid I think you may be too.

He is now back at the much further afield, much more expensive BHS approved yard with all BHS approved instructors. Since then, his riding, particularly jumping, has improved leaps and bounds, he loves going every Friday and everyone is happy. We haven't had a single incident of ponies freaking out and everyone falling off (happened at the other place!), nor of rein snatching, jump refusal of epic nature or anything else outright dangerous.

At the BHS yard, all riders are to collect their pony from the stables, lead to the arena and tighten girths & do stirrups with help if needed. They then lead back and untack after the lesson, putting on rugs (again with help if needed) after the lesson. Ponies are all most suitable for these activities. At the other yard, pony was brought in by a member of staff, child plonked on, and pony swiftly removed after the lesson. When I suggested my son might lead the pony back and untack, this was not allowed.

Find a BHS approved yard with BHS approved instructors. They can still offer a wide range of ponies, from fast to slow, young to old and big to small. You can state that you want your daughter to ride a range of ponies, as some like to keep the same one every week if the child develops a bond. It may cost a little more, but the benefit for your daughter will be immense.

[oakley2012]

I am with you Sage & Onion, it could be a serious injury not just a broken leg, in which your house would have to be modified and your lifestyle completely unside down. My daughter is reading law, and has worked within an equine law firm and is going again this summer, and she tells me that you would not believe the claims they are handling and it is def not wise to have anyone other than a BHSAI or higher to teach, not just for the reason of insurance back up in case of negligence, but also because you know that the person has trained correctly and has passed examinations. Those who think they are good at teaching but dont go through the BHS route are just putting their necks on a block.

I would check into her qualifications by ringing BHS, and if she is not qualified and you are having to instruct from the sideline, then I would recommend that you go to a BHS registered riding school where a range of ponies will be available to suit your daughters standard at that time, and use them instead.

[nia2311]

Jun 16, 2012 18:11:26 GMT oakley2012 said:

I am with you Sage & Onion, it could be a serious injury not just a broken leg, in which your house would have to be modified and your lifestyle completely unside down. My daughter is reading law, and has worked within an equine law firm and is going again this summer, and she tells me that you would not believe the claims they are handling and it is def not wise to have anyone other than a BHSAI or higher to teach, not just for the reason of insurance back up in case of negligence, but also because you know that the person has trained correctly and has passed examinations. Those who think they are good at teaching but dont go through the BHS route are just putting their necks on a block.

I would check into her qualifications by ringing BHS, and if she is not qualified and you are having to instruct from the sideline, then I would recommend that you go to a BHS registered riding school where a range of ponies will be available to suit your daughters standard at that time, and use them instead.

I do agree, but some of the claims people put in are ludicrous. We use a BHS approved yard near Kendal for hacking out - all ponies/horses are fantastic and quite suitable. My son hacks out a 14hh cob and has a whale of a time. They were recently sued by a woman who stated on the form she could canter, jump and was an advanced rider. She was given a large cob called Mick to ride, whom I have ridden before. On the accompanied slow hack, it became apparent she was not experienced, and the escort did not allow her to go faster than walk. She insisted on trotting, and booted Mick into a trot without being asked to do so. Mick slipped, as the ground was slightly wet and he spooked. Woman fell off. She got straight back up, apologised, got back on and finished the ride with no further incident. Incident was logged according to protocol, woman signed it etc.

Months later, a solicitors letter landed. Woman is suing for damage to her wrist which allegedly left her unable to work for 3 weeks. She managed to ride and then drive home though. She also claims Mick is an unsuitable animal. I don't know the outcome of this attempt to sue, but in my opinion, the yard provided a suitable animal to a rider who over stated her ability. She did not follow instructions and put herself at risk. Mick is quite suitable, but is not used for beginners, as I have ridden him, cantered and galloped him across fields and he can get over excited in a group, so needs a confident rider in this type of circumstance. I find this whole situation ludicrous.

I recently came off at a BHS approved yard, did my shoulder a proper mischief. I have ridden the same horse (ex-hunter) for months and he is again quite suited to the experience rider, but has some quirks. I am in a lot of pain, but suing never crossed my mind as it is no-ones fault, its just one of those things and you take the risks when you ride. I am now going to take out personal insurance though (son already insured) ;D

[armada]

Jun 16, 2012 18:21:41 GMT nia2311 said:

Jun 16, 2012 18:11:26 GMT oakley2012 said:

I am with you Sage & Onion, it could be a serious injury not just a broken leg, in which your house would have to be modified and your lifestyle completely unside down. My daughter is reading law, and has worked within an equine law firm and is going again this summer, and she tells me that you would not believe the claims they are handling and it is def not wise to have anyone other than a BHSAI or higher to teach, not just for the reason of insurance back up in case of negligence, but also because you know that the person has trained correctly and has passed examinations. Those who think they are good at teaching but dont go through the BHS route are just putting their necks on a block.

I would check into her qualifications by ringing BHS, and if she is not qualified and you are having to instruct from the sideline, then I would recommend that you go to a BHS registered riding school where a range of ponies will be available to suit your daughters standard at that time, and use them instead.

I do agree, but some of the claims people put in are ludicrous. We use a BHS approved yard near Kendal for hacking out - all ponies/horses are fantastic and quite suitable. My son hacks out a 14hh cob and has a whale of a time. They were recently sued by a woman who stated on the form she could canter, jump and was an advanced rider. She was given a large cob called Mick to ride, whom I have ridden before. On the accompanied slow hack, it became apparent she was not experienced, and the escort did not allow her to go faster than walk. She insisted on trotting, and booted Mick into a trot without being asked to do so. Mick slipped, as the ground was slightly wet and he spooked. Woman fell off. She got straight back up, apologised, got back on and finished the ride with no further incident. Incident was logged according to protocol, woman signed it etc.

Months later, a solicitors letter landed. Woman is suing for damage to her wrist which allegedly left her unable to work for 3 weeks. She managed to ride and then drive home though. She also claims Mick is an unsuitable animal. I don't know the outcome of this attempt to sue, but in my opinion, the yard provided a suitable animal to a rider who over stated her ability. She did not follow instructions and put herself at risk. Mick is quite suitable, but is not used for beginners, as I have ridden him, cantered and galloped him across fields and he can get over excited in a group, so needs a confident rider in this type of circumstance. I find this whole situation ludicrous.

I recently came off at a BHS approved yard, did my shoulder a proper mischief. I have ridden the same horse (ex-hunter) for months and he is again quite suited to the experience rider, but has some quirks. I am in a lot of pain, but suing never crossed my mind as it is no-ones fault, its just one of those things and you take the risks when you ride. I am now going to take out personal insurance though (son already insured) ;D

I do think personal insurance is a good idea, after mulling it over and remembering that years ago a young girl used to come and ride an old pony we had.
I insisted before she took him that her must needed to get the child insured.
The pony was insured, but felt it covered my back in a just in case scenario.
They got insurance through the NFU for the girl, and as I recall it cost about £50.
I also had personal Insurance when eventing, and the one and only time I actually hit the deck cross country was glad of it, and my BUPA as I needed to claim eye-watering amounts due to the severity of my injuries.
Totally my fault, big strong horse got away from me down a long slope and hit the technical fence at the bottom, should have had his butt tucked under for a show-jumping style take off, not thundering on top of it like a long string of washing!

[hs]

Our YO won't allow anyone to use an instructor who is not insured on her yard. Apparently doing this could invalidate her insurance or something like that.

I think there are plenty of good instructors who are not BHS qualified and I think even if you are not BHS qualified you still could get some sort of insurance? People think that they are good friends and won't sue or get sued but situations can change so quickly.

I think it is a tricky one as if your daughter is having fun with the other kids she may be resentful of being taken away from the group and not riding. If these kids are also her school friends and they talk about the fun they are having riding in this group at school she may feel left out.

I think you do need to find out about the insurance though, and then make a decision.

If the instructor is insured and you have a pony lined up in September then I would let your daughter enjoy the summer riding with her friends before the serious show preparation starts.

As for instructor have you thought that she may see you as a pushy mum and therefore does not give your child as much attention as the other children for that reason as she thinks you will just undermine her.

[reb]

Could I point out that if the instructor is providing ponies for the children to ride (ie, instructor makes arrangements with the owner of the ponies for other children to ride them) then, unless the owner of the ponies or the instructor is licensed as a riding school, they are breaking the law.
Providing ponies for hire or reward requires the organiser to be licensed and registered as a riding school. If this is not the case then there will DEFINATELY be no insurance in place - even if the instructor has freelance insurance, this is voided if they have provided the horse/pony.

As a qualified, registered and fully insured instructor, it really irks me when people without insurance and legalities in place offer cut price lessons and take business away from those of us who play by the rules. I am NOT saying that it is essential that your instructor is qualified, there are good and bad instructors out there - both qualified and unqualified. However, they should at the very least have insurance - just like owning a car, you don't have it because you expect to crash, you have it in case you do.

[oakley2012]

Wow this has opened up a can of worms!!! Nici even though it is your pony, your child, and your field, do not be disillusioned that if that instructor failed to check a girth etc and your child came to harm either short term, or long term that because it was on your own property etc that you are held responsible. It is the actions of the instructor on maybe an unsuitable animal that makes them vulnerable. I have a particular insight into the legal side from my daughter's experience of reading many cases and assisting with witness statements etc, and no all cases are not valid for personal injury claims, but many are. Just don't risk it with an instructor using other peoples ponies, there is an element of risk with riding anyway, and it is a courts decision to rule if a party has been negligent and what could have prevented it from happening. There are others who think that they can get a few thousand by claiming, but those normally are thrown out before they ever get to a hearing.

[Kaseyleigh]

Just because your not a qualified instructor doesnt mean your not a good instructor. My advice would be stick at it but if shes having a few lessons a week try and have a private lesson as well as a group lesson so at least shes getting that one to one i find riding a hard pony gives you better balance god when i was six i had a Welsh A stallion as my pony, falling off is a big part of riding as i say your not a good rider till you come off haha but stick at it shes a child at the end of the day bad habbits can be sorted later in life make having horses an enjoyment for her not a chore she can become a serious rider when shes older and knows what she wants juat dont be pushy.

[sageandonion]

No one should set themselves up to teach children if they are not qualified and therefore trained to teach, it isn't just about teaching how to ride, there are all the health and safety aspects. A unqualified person teaches in my area, that person is listed on the sex offenders register. They would have been struck off the BHS register if they were qualified.

[sarahk]

I learnt to ride on a very naughty Exmoor who used to chuck me off all the time, I had lots of fun with her and she taught me so much. When I was younger I wasnt into showing it was all about hacking out with friends and having fun. I think its better to learn on a pony with personality.

I once had to contact my insurance company KBIS about an instructor as she wasnt qualified but had lots of experiece the yard owner of yard I used to be at wasnt happy about her teaching me on his yard so I contacted my insurance and they advised and put it in an email to me that it was fine that she taught me and if I had an accident they would pay out because I was an adult example if my instructor asked me to do something I wasnt comfortable with I am an adult and I can say No where as a child probably wouldnt this was from KBIS therefore she was ok to teach adults but not children.

If this person is charging you for your daughter riding her ponies and she is having lessons seems like a riding school, why not see if your daughter can ride have fun on the ponies without the lessons and contribute by buying feed or maybe even part loan the pony and get your own qualified instructor.

[hs]

But is it hire and reward if the owner of ponies is lending them to the children and not getting any money out of it but the instructor is. Could this be the same say as someone sharing or loaning a pony and then having a lesson with an instructor?

Jun 16, 2012 20:03:14 GMT reb said:

Could I point out that if the instructor is providing ponies for the children to ride (ie, instructor makes arrangements with the owner of the ponies for other children to ride them) then, unless the owner of the ponies or the instructor is licensed as a riding school, they are breaking the law.
Providing ponies for hire or reward requires the organiser to be licensed and registered as a riding school. If this is not the case then there will DEFINATELY be no insurance in place - even if the instructor has freelance insurance, this is voided if they have provided the horse/pony.

As a qualified, registered and fully insured instructor, it really irks me when people without insurance and legalities in place offer cut price lessons and take business away from those of us who play by the rules. I am NOT saying that it is essential that your instructor is qualified, there are good and bad instructors out there - both qualified and unqualified. However, they should at the very least have insurance - just like owning a car, you don't have it because you expect to crash, you have it in case you do.

[welsha]

I think you need to keep her going over the summer. I think the way forward for most kids is private lessons with an instructor they have a rapport with. My kids have had lessons with a few and some big names at that and just havent clicked at all with some of them. We now have one who went right back to basics to get the position right and worked from there and knows just how far to push them without frightening them. The rapport between her and them is great and I see progress after each lesson of both the kids and the ponies.
If she is in a lesson with a number of other children she will not be getting the one to one instruction she needs as its impossible for any instructor to watch 5 or 6 kids at once. I think you should take her to a riding school with a good reputation for one to one lessons. Ok they may be more expensive but if she is getting nothing out of the cheap ones she is having now then its money down the drain anyway. One good lesson a month is better than 4 lessons where she is ignored or having problems with an unsuitable pony. (not that I think she should be on a plod along perfectly schooled pony either as like others have said this will teach her nothing.)
If you leave it until September you will very quickly come against the dark nights, cold weather, 'Dont want to ride today mummy, its too cold' scenario. However keen the kids are they all do this through the winter when they are small. She will take time to gel with new pony too. I would use the summer to cram in some good quality lessons and get her ready as you can to move on with new pony when it comes.

[Karen, garrettponies]

Ditto what Welsha has said.........we both have the same instructor and she has made a big difference to her children and mine. Getting the right instructor is so important and we are very fortunate to have one who understands their individual needs.

[reb]

Jun 20, 2012 22:17:02 GMT hs said:

But is it hire and reward if the owner of ponies is lending them to the children and not getting any money out of it but the instructor is. Could this be the same say as someone sharing or loaning a pony and then having a lesson with an instructor?

No - because (from what I have understood of the post) the instructor is arranging the ponies for the riders to use.

[nia2311]

The original post states "My daughter has been having lessons from a riding instructor on ponies owned by one of the Mums from school."

The ponies are organised by a mother of another child in the lesson, the instructor is independent of this arrangement, and is a third party.

[reb]

In which case, if the parents are paying for the ponies, the 'mum from school' is in the wrong. Either way, if the instructor is involved in arranging the ponies for the children, there will be no insurance. As much as people say that doesn't matter, as has been stated above, it only starts to matter when something catastrophic happens.

OP - as you have very little positive to say about the lessons, I would stop the lessons, maybe look for somewhere else to take her, even if it is only a couple of times.

[FF]

Why are you waiting till September to get a pony?? She will miss all the summer on new pony?

[nici]

I don't think Nursey has her grazing available until September

[rhyfeddol]

Right in the first instace id certainly find out if the child is enjoyng it if she is allow her to continue, many top riders from all spheres had naughty ponies to start with hence they learn to ride. Then if the instructor has insurance then you have no probs, formal qualifications mean nothing for example B.H.S.A.I i have no formal qualifications but have full insurance, C.R.B check an upto date first aid at work cert and have guided many riders to top level showing and workers and the odd 1 to showjumping, some from novice. Experience and the ability to put across to others how to do something is whats required not paper work however there are some very good A.I,s out there but some that can barely ride themselves let alone be allowed to teach others. On the other side i know somebody who will openly admit to been fairly useless on a horse but what an instructor, trained 2 kids from novice to H.O.Y.S workers a girl to grand prix dressage and is great for helping with difficult young horses over fences. Hope you see my point