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Post by mollymalone on Jul 4, 2012 10:29:12 GMT
I am looking to buy a training aid like a pessoa, but actual pessoas are quite expensive and there are cheaper products available but are they as good?
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Post by victoria (highhill) on Jul 4, 2012 10:35:26 GMT
googe Equi Ami -se what you think - i am very impressed with it
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sarahp
Happy to help
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Post by sarahp on Jul 4, 2012 11:09:06 GMT
You could always learn to do it without the aid of gadgets. Or a simple bungy if you really have to use something.
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Post by victoria (highhill) on Jul 4, 2012 11:20:30 GMT
to be honest the equi ami is a bit like bungy but with the bit round the quarters too! Whilst i think its great to do it without gadgets and i am all in favour of that once children are a bit bigger - when you have small young children they are never going to be able to get a pony to work in an outline without a bit of help
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sarahp
Happy to help
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Post by sarahp on Jul 4, 2012 17:06:20 GMT
I suppose it's a showing thing, or maybe an age thing. What are you trying to achieve with a gadget? I lunged, using at most a bungy, to teach obedience etc and make up muscle by working them in a correct outline on the lunge, including working well from behind, but not to teach them to do it automatically by themselves when ridden. Then the children learned to get that outline from on top by riding them correctly, from leg into hand.
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Post by GinaGeo on Jul 4, 2012 17:10:26 GMT
I have discovered a rather excellent use for my previously unused and dusty draw reins. It was a tip given to me by some members off another forum and it's very good. You drape the draw reins over their back, through the front legs and clip it onto the bit/cavesson. You can also add a neckstrap, to put the reins through if you're worried about a horse getting a leg over them. It's a mock up of the Kavalkade Ho, as used by Laura Bechtolsheimer.
Much prefer it to the pessoa as it provides a much steadier contact, no see-sawing with the hind end action, and gives them nothing to lean on. Mine who has always struggled to work over his back, due to various issues over the years, is working through very nicely in it, you can see the difference in engagement, over track and even the muscle movement in his back after 5 minutes with it on.
It provides a less fixed contact than side-reins and even a bungee.
Other than that I've always lunged with two reins, which is excellent for teaching youngsters to lunge.
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Post by victoria (highhill) on Jul 4, 2012 17:51:30 GMT
I suppose it's a showing thing, or maybe an age thing. What are you trying to achieve with a gadget? I lunged, using at most a bungy, to teach obedience etc and make up muscle by working them in a correct outline on the lunge, including working well from behind, but not to teach them to do it automatically by themselves when ridden. Then the children learned to get that outline from on top by riding them correctly, from leg into hand. for me its not a showing thing - its having an 8 year old daughter who has cerebral palsy with a right sided weakness, she cannot keep her right leg in a 'good' position or use it effectively, but she loves to ride and does very well at the moment she is doing intro dressage as well as showing and anything i can do to make things easier for her I will do!! And to add - i have never used it on my youngsters - only on the ridden ponies! |
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sarahp
Happy to help
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Post by sarahp on Jul 4, 2012 18:03:49 GMT
Fair enough - but that is rather a special case! And I was really addressing the OP.
I decided I wasn't that keen on side reins anyway GG as they could draw up and back if they really wanted to evade them, and a stretchy bungie is pretty difficult to lean on, one reason I like them.
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Post by mollymalone on Jul 5, 2012 9:51:08 GMT
I asked for recommendations on alternative training aids, not for someone who does not know me, my experience levels or my horse to pass judgment.
You may not agree with training "aids" but that does not mean they do not have a place and a benefit when used correctly and for the correct purposes in modern schooling.
Thank you for those that read my post correctly without judgment.
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Post by m&mwhp on Jul 5, 2012 10:59:41 GMT
I bought a cheap version of a pessoa off eBay a couple of years ago, have a look on there but have no idea if they sell them now or not! Should be about £30 or so!
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sarahp
Happy to help
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Post by sarahp on Jul 5, 2012 11:12:01 GMT
You asked for cheaper - not using one at all is definitely cheaper, so what I said was relevant to your question, not a judgment, which I didn't give.
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Post by LucyHebditch on Jul 5, 2012 11:39:59 GMT
Pessoa's are the only gadget I use! They actually make them work properly. They make the back end work, which I don't think any others do.
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Post by thimble on Jul 5, 2012 20:49:20 GMT
The John Whitaker Training aid is identical to the Pessoa. It comes with a complete with a roller as well. Top quality product and does exactly the same thing. Cheapest place to buy I found was Mole Valley Farmers. Good luck.
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Post by clarasdream on Jul 6, 2012 11:56:34 GMT
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Post by stormyskies on Jul 10, 2012 18:29:08 GMT
Equi ami. Its excellent
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Post by elmere on Jul 10, 2012 21:56:58 GMT
I bought a cheap kincade version off Robinsons, ordered today so not sure what its like yet, I also have a de gogue but it doesn't work their back end the same as the pessoa, there is the option to ride with it though.
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Post by whp94 on Jul 12, 2012 9:21:28 GMT
I ordered the kavalkade ho lunging aid, thought I'd try it as I normally use my Pessoa. What a load of rubbish it was!! Both my ponies who are very differently built (one needs to be work long and low and the other tends to go onto her forehand) both went round like donkeys!! Very un impressed, shall be sticking to my Pessoa from now on.
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Post by GinaGeo on Jul 12, 2012 9:48:01 GMT
I ordered the kavalkade ho lunging aid, thought I'd try it as I normally use my Pessoa. What a load of rubbish it was!! Both my ponies who are very differently built (one needs to be work long and low and the other tends to go onto her forehand) both went round like donkeys!! Very un impressed, shall be sticking to my Pessoa from now on. I'm very impressed with my Kavalcade Ho mock up. How did you have it fitted? You could try putting a neckstrap on them and then threading the rein to the bit through that. It lifts the contact which some of them like. |
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Post by pimms'o'clock (Jess) on Jul 12, 2012 10:50:23 GMT
I love my pessoa!!! They are extremely expensive however theyre definitly an investment, ive had mine for about 7 years and its still as good as new  my friend does have the john whittaker version which is more value for money and even comes with a roller which the pessoa doesnt Sent from my LT26i using ProBoards |
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Post by whp94 on Jul 12, 2012 11:10:12 GMT
I ordered the kavalkade ho lunging aid, thought I'd try it as I normally use my Pessoa. What a load of rubbish it was!! Both my ponies who are very differently built (one needs to be work long and low and the other tends to go onto her forehand) both went round like donkeys!! Very un impressed, shall be sticking to my Pessoa from now on. I'm very impressed with my Kavalcade Ho mock up. How did you have it fitted? You could try putting a neckstrap on them and then threading the rein to the bit through that. It lifts the contact which some of them like. I had it so the leather adjuster thingy was sat on their back just down from the withers in line with their spine, then went down in between their front legs and clipped onto the bit - is that right? They both normally work lovely in the Pessoa, it was as if I was just lunging them in a head collar using the kavalkade! Will try the neck strap thanks ginageo |
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Post by GinaGeo on Jul 12, 2012 11:14:13 GMT
Yeah that sounds about right. It doesn't need to be tight but it does need a good contact, when they're working correctly it should be loose. Mine works very nicely in it, better than in a pessoa which he drops behind and overbends! They're all different though aren't they! I found the neckstrap lifts the contact and encourages a more advanced outline. I also tie the strap over their back to the neckstrap with apiece of baler twine as it worked it's way back a little.
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Post by Peachy Pony on Jul 12, 2012 11:22:02 GMT
I ordered a copy of perssoa on e bay think it only cost me £30 and it had free p and p
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Post by whp94 on Jul 12, 2012 11:48:34 GMT
Yeah that sounds about right. It doesn't need to be tight but it does need a good contact, when they're working correctly it should be loose. Mine works very nicely in it, better than in a pessoa which he drops behind and overbends! They're all different though aren't they! I found the neckstrap lifts the contact and encourages a more advanced outline. I also tie the strap over their back to the neckstrap with apiece of baler twine as it worked it's way back a little. I've tried it relatively loose and also tightened it up more and still no difference! I thought it maybe just the pony didnt like it but then I tried it on another which tends to go onto the forehand and even she went round with no outline! Yeah I found it slips back slightly - I will have another go! Only reason I bought it was because my pessoa seems to of stretched on one side and keeps pulling pony's head to the outside and the fleecey part around there back end keeps slipping round - anyone found this? I'm thinking its maybe because it's a cheaper copy version? |
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dappledgreypony
Junior Member
Jumping is dressage with speed bumps
Posts: 141 
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Post by dappledgreypony on Jul 15, 2012 8:51:39 GMT
If you want to ride using *gadgets* then side reins & bungee are quite effective if used correctly.
DGP
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Post by marypom on Jul 15, 2012 11:30:07 GMT
i sell the john whitaker and also the gfs they are both good... sell a lot of the gfs......
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Post by northbeech on Aug 1, 2012 19:55:31 GMT
Personally im not into gadgets, however, i do use a pessoa on my competition horses/ It is a fantastic aid for building muscle - if used correctly.
I do not like bungee's or side reins at all - They are quite frankly something to 'Pull the horses head in' They do nothing at all for the hind end and actually very little for the front end - and before i get shot down for my opinion, i am an experienced horse person with over 7 years experience showjumping affiliated and 2 years experience of affiliated dressage up to medium level, so i do have an idea of what i am talking about.
Although a pony cannot lean on a bungee like they can side reins, it is still a constant pressure on the mouth to pull the horses head 'in' often leading to a 'hard' mouth. Same with the side reins, there is no give.
The pessoa is a training aid that works the same way as a person would when schooling - 'giving and taking' , it is not fixed at any point and it moves with the horse encouraging the horse to move forwards and engage with the hind legs while dropping down into a correct outline. The pessoa does not 'hold' a horse in any certain position and it should always be used in a 'long and low' way with plenty of give - an overtightened pessoa will have the opposite effect making it difficult for the horse to move properly which will build muscle in all the wrong places.
It is also very difficult work for a pony so build up gradually only using it for 10 mins at first and never using it for longer than 20 - always make sure you unclip it at the end of session and give the horse a 'stretching off' period in walk so stop them from stiffening up.
Iv had my pessoa for 9 years and it has been a great investment - i use it twice a week on my competition horses and would never use any other training aid.
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sarahp
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Post by sarahp on Aug 1, 2012 21:51:26 GMT
I always use a bungee over the top of the head, encouraging the animal to go long and low rather than throwing the head up, and adjusted as long as possible while still doing its job. There is nothing fixed or holding about something so elastic. Maybe different people use them differently. I've always managed to engage the hindlegs with my aids when lunging rather than use anything round the hindquarters - after all, you don't when riding.
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my friend does have the john whittaker version which is more value for money and even comes with a roller which the pessoa doesnt 
