Doesn't Understand Personal Space

[willow001]

Just wondered if i could pick your brains. I have a 2 year old who i am having a bit of a problem with. He is brilliant in so many ways but is a really pushy boy around food and if he wants attention. He seems to take absolutely no notice of body language from the other horses or me. I used to have a really dominant alpha mare and he didn't even take any notice of her. Consequently gets bitten and kicked an awful lot. Any tips on things i could do with him to help with this? Thanks

[sarahp]

No ideas re the other horses, he'll just have to get bossed about until the penny drops. But for you, which is more important, I'd suggest lots of halter work from the ground to help get the right relationship - you must be boss! You must be consistent in what you expect, demand it and not give him an inch. Don't feed from your hand, always from a bin or bucket, and don't let him mug you for it but make him wait until you have put it down on the ground, but do that immediately he does the right thing by waiting and not mugging you. Ignore him if he behaves badly but fuss him if he is good - the idea is not to reward bad behaviour by giving in to it but to reward good immediately.

[junetimp]

Again no suggestion for horse space but I have for human personal space.
Human personal space is so important, having had a friend who had broken ribs when her horse pushed through a doorway at the same time.

I too have a two year old 15.3. Now she is excellent, but they just have to learn social graces, unfortunately its not something they know from birth.

I always use my voice. Whatever words you choose mine are Wait and No. These I back up with - wait for it - my finger nail. If she tries to walk all over me and trample into my space I say the correct word and prod my finger nail into usually the chest (Do not recommend the backend area as may lead to a sharp retaliation.) This method also works well when asking a horse to move over in the stable but again be careful were you prod, the front rib area is a good area.

If you were to use the flat of your hand they then just push back and with strength on their side you will end up losing the battle. It is absolutely amazing how much respect a horse has for a human finger nail and its something you always have to hand (no pun intended), even in an emergency.

Just keep repeating the process whenever necessary.

Now when I say loudly my word - Wait or No I get an immediate response with no use of the finger nail and it even works if she is the other side of the yard to me.

[sarahp]

Fine if you have long fingernails, which I don't! I do use the end of a key instead though, but I tend to hold it out from me (I often use this one for those that run a shoulder into you when being led) so that they run themselves into it if they go to push you rather than you poking them with it. It does need to be something not sharp enough to do any damage, but sharp enough for them to find unpleasant.

[gillwales]

I agree with junetime, my words are also wait and no!
Always lead wearing gloves and carry a cane, point the cane towards his muzzle when you want him to turn away from you. poke him in the shoulder if he leans on you or encroaches in your space. Dont forget to wear steal toe cap boots for safety.

[B_31]

Jan 1, 2013 18:39:46 GMT junetimp said:

Again no suggestion for horse space but I have for human personal space.
Human personal space is so important, having had a friend who had broken ribs when her horse pushed through a doorway at the same time.

I too have a two year old 15.3. Now she is excellent, but they just have to learn social graces, unfortunately its not something they know from birth.

I always use my voice. Whatever words you choose mine are Wait and No. These I back up with - wait for it - my finger nail. If she tries to walk all over me and trample into my space I say the correct word and prod my finger nail into usually the chest (Do not recommend the backend area as may lead to a sharp retaliation.) This method also works well when asking a horse to move over in the stable but again be careful were you prod, the front rib area is a good area.

If you were to use the flat of your hand they then just push back and with strength on their side you will end up losing the battle. It is absolutely amazing how much respect a horse has for a human finger nail and its something you always have to hand (no pun intended), even in an emergency.

Just keep repeating the process whenever necessary.

Now when I say loudly my word - Wait or No I get an immediate response with no use of the finger nail and it even works if she is the other side of the yard to me.

thats a brilliant idea!! i will try this as i finally have nails!!




my 2 year old hasnt a clue about personal space and is also food aggresive.... if i ask her to back up around food i will get boxed and kicked (no kidding........)

she WAS improving - then i sent her away and she seems to have forgotten everything and gone worse...so she is now nasty once i put her feed in (do not enter her stable basically)

im slowly introducing talking while shes eating over the door which dosent cause a reaction - its just when i ask her to move away from food - she gets aggresive (i mean to back up when im putting it in)


youngsters are a long slog - i personally, have definately bitten off more than i can chew HOWEVER i am not often defeated !!!

[sarahp]

It's very very easy to teach all this stuff when they are foals, which I do with mine, but far more difficult to have to get them out of bad habits later, I do sympathise with anyone dealing with this problem.

They don't get their feed bin put on the ground for them to eat from unless they are polite with ears forward. The big foal spontaneously moved back in the box to my hand raised towards her chest yesterday to give me room to put down her breakfast.

[junetimp]

I personally, have definately bitten off more than i can chew HOWEVER i am not often defeated !!!


Don't worry you will be ok BECAUSE you are willing to ask listen and learn !



None of us know everything and even after years of experience I am still learning new things even today.
A thing which helped me is a good book with chapter called ‘Cocky youngster’ which I can recommend is:-

‘The 100% Horse’ by Michael Peace. Amazon
How to create the go-anywhere, do –anything horse.

They do say that the ones that are the hardest to train make the best horses in the end ?

I think from what you are saying it sounds to me like you really need to sort out these problems and soon before your horse gets much bigger, older and stronger.

Ask yourself why is this happening ?
Is she hungry?
Has she been hungry in the past?
Has she had to fight for her food?
At first perhaps if you have the time split her feed into four or five little feeds and then you have the opportunity to practice manners on a regular basis over a couple of hours. Don’t forget to use the voice aids !
Repetition is the best way for youngsters to learn.

[sarahp]

I now don't buy in any (well, not very often!) so only really have home bred babies to deal with, thank goodness! I'm past dealing with anything big and bad mannered now.

I agree, one is never beyond learning new things, it's just a question of having an open mind and being prepared to.

[willow001]

Thanks everyone. He's actually very well mannered when doing groundwork and will back and step over at light finger pressure. He understands wait and no he just forgets himself. Doesn't help that he rarely puts his ears forward so always looks grumpy. Ive had him since 6 months old so know his history. Was brought up in a herd of mares and foals so no real reason why he shouldn't understand their body language. Hes brilliant to walk out, groom, pick up feet, tie up, oil his legs etc. I make him come into the corale at feed time where he is tied up and has to wait nicely to get his bucket. I just feel like somehow im failing him as i can't break through these little things. Also twice in the last 6 months when being reprimanded out of my space he's reared up and come down on me. Then stands there looking almost confused