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Post by bbanks on Mar 2, 2009 23:31:29 GMT
Thinking of mating my schnauzer this time with a mini poodle, any one got a schnoodle? There seems to be quite a demmand, not that I have any problem selling the pedigree ones. Any input appreciated!!
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Post by rabbit on Mar 3, 2009 15:25:08 GMT
we've got a mini at stud! proven, kc reg and BVA current clear eye test cert. we breed mini labradoodles cheers
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Post by chloe2 on Oct 2, 2009 19:38:01 GMT
Why breed more dogs when the rescue centres are inundated?If you want a puppy or a dog go there. Why add to a growing problem??
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fredaf
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Post by fredaf on Oct 2, 2009 19:44:17 GMT
Yes well said chloe!
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Milliesmum
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Post by Milliesmum on Oct 2, 2009 21:37:22 GMT
I feel that bbanks is the responsible type by the fact that they have asked the question - they are considering the options and asking for opinions before going ahead, so aren't rushing into anything without proper thought. A rescue dog isn't the best option for everyone - if you have small children you may not want a dog with an unknown history.
I just feel it's a little unfair to bbanks - they aren't responsible for the countless unwanted dogs out there. I applaud your sentiment - just feel that it's not necessarily directed at the right person!
BBanks, in answer to your question, have not experienced a schnoodle, however I do have a poodle cross (Millie in my avatar), and her temperament is second to none, she is the most friendly loving little dog but still with bags of personality! And the poodle crosses are very popular at the moment, I'm sure you would be able to pick and choose to find them the best homes.
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fredaf
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Post by fredaf on Oct 2, 2009 21:54:40 GMT
well maybe best to stick to one breed then.
The growing trend to cross breed (dressed up as something fashionable) is not one responsible breeders promote and in the long term is likely to be detrimental to pure breds.
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Milliesmum
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Post by Milliesmum on Oct 2, 2009 22:09:04 GMT
Well I'm not an expert on dog breeding and I'm speaking purely as a one pet dog owner, but I don't understand, why is it detrimental and irresponsible? Genuinely interested! If there's a demand for these dogs, and they are getting good homes as family pets, and the bit*h can be put in pup again with a pedigree litter at a later date, how has that harmed the breed?
Incidentally, the reason I got Millie was that I had met a c0ckerpoo at a show who had the most fabulous friendly outgoing temperament, a real 'people' dog, and that was what I was looking for in a family pet, not something that would look fashionable on the end of a designer lead! And I didn't rush straight out and get one, I waited till the time was right, i.e. kids in full time school etc. so it was all done in a very responsible manner.
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Post by jasper1 on Oct 3, 2009 7:28:43 GMT
I have a litter of 4 week old jack-a-poos, all reserved by fab families. I did a fair amount of research into breeding them and all feedback was great. I met a two schnnoodles at a ODE , one was 7 the other younger, they were ab fab little dogs. Just because a a dog is a pure bred does not mean that it is responsibly bred, using the best dogs. Hope you enjoy breeding your litter, its great fun watching them grow, good luck.
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Post by jasper1 on Oct 3, 2009 7:29:54 GMT
Oh yes i have the number for a fab miniture choc poodle if you need it
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Post by pencaedu on Oct 3, 2009 8:07:08 GMT
slightly off topic, but I have a mini schnauzer & a yorkie. Let them out yesterday morning (still dark). Could hear the 'what do you think you're doing on my yard, don't you know it's not a right of way' bark. Went to investigate. She'd encountered her first hedgehog & was telling it off!! Dont' you just love the attitude of mini schnauzers. They own everthing!!
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Post by chloe2 on Oct 3, 2009 12:43:01 GMT
A rescue dog isn't the best option for everyone - if you have small children you may not want a dog with an unknown history. I just feel it's a little unfair to bbanks - they aren't responsible for the countless unwanted dogs out there. I applaud your sentiment - just feel that it's not necessarily directed at the right person! . If you are concerned about history then there are plenty of puppies in rescue centres - often whose full history is known. Anyone who breeds is responsible for the countless unwanted dogs - someone bred them! My point is there are too many dogs without homes - so why keep breeding more? Same goes for horses - like the meat man does, you can buy welsh/shetlands/NF etc for buttons at sales - so why breed more when the market is flooded. I love puppies/kittens/foals they are a joy, but I think it is wrong to think of them as £signs. I wish others would stop and think about the reasons why they are breeding certain types. My reply was not directed at any individual but I feel someone needs to speak for the poor animals who ultimately suffer when the market place becomes flooded. |
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Milliesmum
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Post by Milliesmum on Oct 3, 2009 16:25:14 GMT
Well I can see where you're coming from, but I think you'll find there's no problem with rehoming puppies, it's the older dogs that can stay in the rescue centres for month after month. I don't think it would be realistic to say no one is to breed any more puppies till the rescue centres are empty - that's just not going to happen is it? By starting this thread bbanks is trying to make sure that they are breeding something there is demand for and will be going to good homes - the people you need to target are those who let their unneutered mongrels roam the streets and have litters that were un-planned and have no concern as to what they are going to do with unwanted puppies.
Sorry, I still think your concern whilst valid is a little misdirected.
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Post by cassie30 on Oct 3, 2009 17:52:19 GMT
Just one question i have, but doesn't it just mean they are "mongrels", they used to sell at £40 in the paper, now because people are intentionally doing it they sell for hundreds!
I do agree with points on both sides, there certainly are lots of people breeding and probably too many people doing it, but, as MM states, there are plenty of people letting them wonder the streets unneutered.
But, still, cross breeds are still mongrels and who knows what problems it will cause, there are lots trying it out because they are in demand, lots ending up with breathing difficulties because of the lack of knowledge, like i said fair points on both side but we are awash with any kind of animal already, maybe it is time for all breeders to take a break?? am not saying this is what bbanks is doing, trying it out etc, but lots are, look in the free ads twice a week!
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Milliesmum
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Post by Milliesmum on Oct 3, 2009 18:51:41 GMT
Just one point re the 'mongrels' thing, yes my dog is classed as a crossbreed, the vet says there tend to be less health issues due to 'hybrid vigour' with crosses, which is backed up by the insurance prices - to insure a pedigree dog is about 30% more expensive! But yes they do sell for the same price as pedigree dogs - which is fair in a way as the costs involved, e.g. stud fees, feeding and care, veterinary costs etc are the same regardless of whether the litter is pedigree or a crossbreed.
The only thing I would say would differ is the value of the puppy as a breeding animal - I was told that a first cross is preferable as the results are more predictable - although I don't know how correct that is. Irrelevant to me anyway as Millie has been neutered for the health benefits involved, and was always intended to be a family pet.
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Post by cassie30 on Oct 3, 2009 19:42:53 GMT
But they are really still mongrels, didnt the craze start with labradoodles? now there is a cross of just about every breed going! just really believe people should slow the breeding down now, the recession hit alot of people hard, they bought pups then could no longer afford, so its all fine and nice breeders etc finding nice homes, but as with any animal, there is no guarantee the nice home can keep it for good.
The person with the point about rescue centres is right, but MM you are right too, they have lots of adult dogs left there, all pups become adults at some point, surely equalling more adult doggies in rescue centres in the future?
I do think bbanks is being responsible in checking it out first though.
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Post by jodles on Oct 3, 2009 20:09:15 GMT
In answer to the original question - Schnoodles are adorable little dogs. I work in a Vets practice and have recently had in 2 or 3 schnoodle puppies - very cute!! ;D
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Post by cassie30 on Oct 3, 2009 20:13:46 GMT
lol im sure they are!! love little doggies!
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Post by puddledub on Oct 3, 2009 20:21:15 GMT
I breed Labradors and German Shorthaired Pointers, and to be honest I am more shocked by how many irresponsible breeders there are of purebreds.
I have also bred 3 litters of labradoodles using my labrador b1tches who have incredible pedigrees almost solid red with Field Trial Champions, have been hip scored and eye tested and use Stud Dogs who have had all the relevant health checks and also either been proven in the show ring or their offspring have.
All my 'doodle puppies have been reared with the same care and attention as any of my 'purebred' puppies and have gone to their new, well vetted homes with free insurance, puppy packs, FULL PEDIGREE and I have heard from almost all of their owners on a regular basis to keep me updated on their progress. The only difference in price to rearing a 'purebred' puppy is the £12 per puppy Kennel Club registration fee.
I took exception to some of the misleading claims by some breeders of the alleged 'hypo-allergenic' qualities of some of the poodle crossbreeds as they CANNOT be guarantee to suit people with allergies as all allergies are different and caused by different things, for example some people are allergic to the dog saliva nd would therefore be allergic to ANY dog. They can also not be guaranteed to be non-shedding as is also regulalry claimed as they also carry labrador genes.
Having said that, I have successfully homed puppies to people who never thought they would be able to have a dog because of their allergies including one lady who reacted to another litter of 'doodles but after sitting in the controlled environment of her own car with the puppy for 45 minutes, was allowed to buy one of my pups and I get a Xmas card from her each year thanking me for changing her life!
There are good and bad breeders of all breeds of dogs (as there are with horses and ponies) and I would just ask all buyers to go with their gut instinct when buying a puppy.
.... and there is a significant difference between a crossbreed and a mongrel. A crossbreed is a cross between 2 known dogs of full pedigree but of different breeds, a mongrel is a dog of indermenant parentage (and usually the result of 'mongrel' parents).
As far as rescue centres are concerned, well I could go on at great length about many of them, but I can honestly say that I do not think that ANY of my puppy buyers would have gone and taken a puppy from one of these centres, even if they had not bought one of my puppies. Like people looking for a specific breed of dog, those looking for a specific crossbreed are looking for just that and not anything else.
Sorry, very long post!! Brownie points to all those who read it from start to finish!!
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Post by jasper1 on Oct 5, 2009 7:01:31 GMT
Long, but full of very good points!
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Post by thecremellosociety on Oct 5, 2009 10:26:58 GMT
No dog expert, but also poodle crosses are quite popular as if the poodle coat is inherited good for persons with coat allergies ? if you breed responsibly for a market whereby they are wanted, there arenot many small dogs in rescue centres, we may be looking for a small puppy in the future, i wouldnt take on a older one now as prefer a blank canvas, and like to know about thier past.
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Milliesmum
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Post by Milliesmum on Oct 5, 2009 10:36:09 GMT
As puddledub says it can't be guaranteed, but we don't get any dog hair at all from Millie, only downside is she has to go for regular grooming/haircuts, so you need to be aware that will be a cost to budget for. I pay £20 about every six weeks.
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Post by vetnurse on Oct 5, 2009 14:51:15 GMT
as a vet nurse i cannot explain how frustrating it is with the amount of people breeding dogs! if only everyone did something about it by encouraging people to rehome rescues and not trying to make themselves money, as lets be fair that is the only reason people do it. yes it is lovely to breed and can be enjoyable but its a lot of hard work and its not very nice for the bit*h so money must be the main drive. rant over!!!!
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Post by chloe2 on Oct 5, 2009 18:56:46 GMT
as a vet nurse i cannot explain how frustrating it is with the amount of people breeding dogs! if only everyone did something about it by encouraging people to rehome rescues and not trying to make themselves money, as lets be fair that is the only reason people do it. yes it is lovely to breed and can be enjoyable but its a lot of hard work and its not very nice for the bit*h so money must be the main drive. rant over!!!! Like you, I am quite involved with animals and it is very frustrating. Recently a large well known charity only had cross and mongrel puppies to rehome (most quite small breeds ::)I wonder why!)- they were actively trying to encourage people to take on pups due to being over run with them. While I really wasn't having a go at any individual I just want people to pause and think for a minute. |
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Post by busybusy on Oct 15, 2009 12:09:52 GMT
Chloe2 I do applaud your sentiments....however, several years ago we decided that we would like a dog. We had been dog owners for many years but had not replaced our old dog when he passed away about 7 years earlier due to the children being small/work etc.
We decided that we were in a position to give a dog a good home - although out at work we had someone coming in midday to bring ponies in etc. We approached 3 animal charities (one was the RSPCA and 2 were independent). All 3 refused on the grounds that we worked...despite us saying we had excellent paid help on a daily basis! I even got a reference letter from our vet - still no joy! They didn't even bother doing a house visit (I had suggested they randomly pick a day and check if there was someone around in the middle of the day!)
Whilst I understood their stance, I thought having a "hard and fast" rule was to the dog's disadvantage. By the way we had said that whilst we preferred a puppy, we would take an older dog.....or 2 together! The RSPCA person I spoke to on the phone was actually very offhand with me, and insinuated that I knew nothing about the care of animals!
We now have 2 much loved, well cared for little dogs who came straight from their breeder.
Sorry to go off topic!!
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Post by cassie30 on Oct 15, 2009 12:20:13 GMT
Busybusy, which branch was this?
My next door neighbour has just taken on a dog through the rspca and she works, so does her OH?
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Milliesmum
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Post by Milliesmum on Oct 22, 2009 18:03:05 GMT
If breeding crosses is purely about money, how is that any different from breeding pedigree dogs - is that not about the money then? If not what IS it about?
If you don't agree with breeding crosses - then don't breed them!! But why shouldn't other people if there is a demand for them? And who says they are going to end up in rescue centres? If you have researched your market and can be sure of getting good homes, then why should they end up in rescue centres? As has been stated above theres a difference between a mongrel and a crossbreed.
Oh, and Millie is particularly offended at being referred to as a Mutt!!!
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Post by Philippa on Oct 22, 2009 18:29:56 GMT
I am so pleased to read the comments on here regarding people being against crossbreeding as last time I got into this i got slated.
I am appalled at the illicit crossbreeding, people think that by outcrossing something with breed health issues (most dogs have some) they are bettering the welfare of the dog - sorry but this is total pants. What you are in fact doing is crossing the bad points of one breed with the bad points of another therefor giving the dog even more health issues. There is a really good article on it which I will try to find and post.
With reference to breeding purebreds for money then no sorry - disagree. We breed ours to better the stock we have and from our 2 litters of Boston terriers we have only let 2 go, one was a mismark and the other far too large - neither suitable for the ring. All the rest have been kept even though we had lists of people wanting a puppy at £1500 a throw.
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Milliesmum
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Post by Milliesmum on Oct 22, 2009 18:38:19 GMT
But aren't the people who show dogs just a small minority of the dog owning population? And why shouldn't those of us who just want a family pet have a crossbreed if we want one? And if a crossbreed is likely to have more health issues than a pedigree dog, can someone explain to me why the insurance premiums are lower?
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Post by cassie30 on Oct 22, 2009 18:39:11 GMT
Not just me then, thats good!
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Milliesmum
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Post by Milliesmum on Oct 22, 2009 19:38:02 GMT
Wow nic101, why don't you say what you really feel! But I didn't buy from a puppy farm! I bought from a very nice lady who usually breeds pedigree dogs (c0cker spaniels) who had bred a single litter of c0ckerpoos. All of which had been reserved for family homes. And isn't the Labradoodle now a recognised breed? If you go back far enough all breeds are crosses, weren't they all wolves in the beginning? As regards insurance cover, I'm talking about insuring for veterinary fees - surely the vet doesn't charge any differently for pedigrees as opposed to crosses - yet the premiums are less, can only mean that the insurance companies don't have to pay as much out in vet fees for crossbreeds. I'm not going to comment any more on this, you're obviously a person with very strong views, which is fine but we're never going to agree so perhaps we should just agree to differ.  |
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