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Post by cg on May 9, 2016 10:03:27 GMT
My horse tends to lean in his French link Pelham that I show him in. He has a very fleshy tongue and is schooled in a loose ring French link at home in a grackle, he is naturally fleshy and therefore quite mouthy, not a health issue, back, teeth, tack etc checked regularly, its just him!
At a show he is ridden in a fylde hunter crank noseband with a French link Pelham. I have tried a double before, but there just isn't the room in there for both bits, although at times he is softer he opens his mouth a lot and just doesn't feel as comfortable, everytime I try something new I resort back to the trusty Pelham, he goes sweetly but leans, which he does not do in his snaffle. Is there anything that can help this?
I tried a hartwell Pelham to give him more room but he HATED it! I ride side saddle so double reins is compulsory, would a rugby Pelham help this?
Thanks in advance any help much appreciated.
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Post by gillwales on May 9, 2016 11:32:51 GMT
I think schooling is the answer, also try replacing your curb chain for an elastic one, then it will be more similar to his everyday bit. Lots of transition work,change of bend. Avoid the crank noseband as a caverson should allow room for a man's finger to avoid pinching. There has been an article recently in the H & H advising of the problems over-tight nosebands can cause. Do lots of work that makes him think rather than leaning on your arms. You need to encourage self carriage. Does he do this when you ride him astride? Just a thought. Does he have wolf teeth? If so it might be better for him if they are removed and give him more room in his mouth.
Good luck
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Post by cg on May 9, 2016 11:48:55 GMT
I think schooling is the answer, also try replacing your curb chain for an elastic one, then it will be more similar to his everyday bit. Lots of transition work,change of bend. Avoid the crank noseband as a caverson should allow room for a man's finger to avoid pinching. There has been an article recently in the H & H advising of the problems over-tight nosebands can cause. Do lots of work that makes him think rather than leaning on your arms. You need to encourage self carriage. Does he do this when you ride him astride? Just a thought. Does he have wolf teeth? If so it might be better for him if they are removed and give him more room in his mouth. Good luck Thank You Gill. He doesn't lean in his snaffle and he works at elementary/medium level dressage, its just in the Pelham he leans? That is whether he is astride or side saddle for both, I hope that makes sense? He had his wolf teeth out years ago. I don't know whether to try a double again or not has he can go very sweetly just off the bradoon? Would there be a Weymouth you recommend, the one I used to use was a sliding cheek low ported Weymouth. I will try using the noseband differently thank you, I just don't want him opening his mouth in the ring making him look like he is trying to evade, when actually it is just him and a habit he tends to have occasionally. Thank you for your help  |
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Post by gillwales on May 9, 2016 12:32:59 GMT
you are welcome, give the elastic curb chain a go, it is inexpensive and it is nearly always better to go for a softer option. The Weymouth you used sounds ideal so long as it has short checks ( we used to call it a tom thumb, but not the new use of the name ) The beauty of using a double is the ability to use the bits independantly. When you ise the pelham try to ride him more on the top rein rather than the curb rein as this is the closest to riding off of the bradoon. When I asked the question it was to see if there was a difference and if that could be used to improve things.
I would usually recommend thicker bits as they are milder, but in your horse's case it would be the oposite due to his tongue. Do remember that his tongue will have an influence on his breathing, avoid anything that restricts this.
How nice it is to see someone riding side saddle has well as astride, it was something I never had the opotunity to try.
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Post by cg on May 9, 2016 13:08:24 GMT
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Post by sjw87 on May 9, 2016 18:27:03 GMT
Have you ever tried a waterford? Often horses with fleshy tongues like the fact that the bit is completely mobile.
If he's 5.5", I have a very unique waterford pelham for sale shortly - it's a bit small for the horse I use it for so am having a bigger one made
Sent from my SM-A300FU using proboards
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Post by cg on May 10, 2016 8:58:46 GMT
Have you ever tried a waterford? Often horses with fleshy tongues like the fact that the bit is completely mobile. If he's 5.5", I have a very unique waterford pelham for sale shortly - it's a bit small for the horse I use it for so am having a bigger one made Sent from my SM-A300FU using proboards Thank you! Yes he is 5.5" and no I have never tried a Waterford? he has a very soft mouth so I always use French links on him, I was always under the impression water fords were quite strong, however I know any bit can be in certain hands, I like to think I have soft hands  ! Maybe a Waterford would not be a bad idea so he cannot hang onto it? If you have a picture I would love to see it my email is chloelg@hotmail.com thank you. |
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Post by gillwales on May 10, 2016 11:12:20 GMT
thank you for your kind offer, but I would not inflict myself or my body on your poor cob!
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Post by sjw87 on May 11, 2016 5:53:17 GMT
Have you ever tried a waterford? Often horses with fleshy tongues like the fact that the bit is completely mobile. If he's 5.5", I have a very unique waterford pelham for sale shortly - it's a bit small for the horse I use it for so am having a bigger one made Sent from my SM-A300FU using proboards Thank you! Yes he is 5.5" and no I have never tried a Waterford? he has a very soft mouth so I always use French links on him, I was always under the impression water fords were quite strong, however I know any bit can be in certain hands, I like to think I have soft hands ! Maybe a Waterford would not be a bad idea so he cannot hang onto it? If you have a picture I would love to see it my email is chloelg@hotmail.com thank you. Will email you today from work - the horse it was made for sounds very similar to your boy x Sent from my SM-A300FU using proboards |
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Post by cg on May 11, 2016 7:55:10 GMT
Thank you! Yes he is 5.5" and no I have never tried a Waterford? he has a very soft mouth so I always use French links on him, I was always under the impression water fords were quite strong, however I know any bit can be in certain hands, I like to think I have soft hands ! Maybe a Waterford would not be a bad idea so he cannot hang onto it? If you have a picture I would love to see it my email is chloelg@hotmail.com thank you. Will email you today from work - the horse it was made for sounds very similar to your boy x Sent from my SM-A300FU using proboards Thank you! He is the boy in my picture but you cant really tell as he is jumping! |
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Post by sjw87 on May 12, 2016 8:43:59 GMT
Hi cg, just to let you know I sent you an email yesterday. Let me know if you think it may be suitable as I'm happy to offer you first refusal. If it isn't suitable, I hope you find something he's comfortable in soon - bit banks can be invaluable x
Sent from my SM-A300FU using proboards
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sarahp
Happy to help
Posts: 9,510
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Post by sarahp on May 13, 2016 10:15:45 GMT
First, I rode my D in a leather curb - but adjusted SO loosely that it never came into action as she hated the feeling, sensitive soul!
Second, I have used Waterfords on two of daughter's horses with great success, one a snaffle and the other a gag. In both cases the horses could get very strong but wouldn't tolerate a curb, luckily she wasn't showing them! Both were very happy in the bit and didn't object to it in any way, it is of course a question of the hands at the other end. I'm think it worth a try for you, being totally flexible I can see how they suit horses with difficult mouths and are impossible to lean on.
Being a grumpy old woman I mutter at all jointed pelhams as they messes up the designed action totally, but as you say showing requires two reins - somehow!
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Post by cg on May 13, 2016 11:22:49 GMT
First, I rode my D in a leather curb - but adjusted SO loosely that it never came into action as she hated the feeling, sensitive soul! Second, I have used Waterfords on two of daughter's horses with great success, one a snaffle and the other a gag. In both cases the horses could get very strong but wouldn't tolerate a curb, luckily she wasn't showing them! Both were very happy in the bit and didn't object to it in any way, it is of course a question of the hands at the other end. I'm think it worth a try for you, being totally flexible I can see how they suit horses with difficult mouths and are impossible to lean on. Being a grumpy old woman I mutter at all jointed pelhams as they messes up the designed action totally, but as you say showing requires two reins - somehow! Thank You Sarah! I am in 2 minds what to do! I have received the email mentioned above and the bit looks great however never in my dreams would I think to spend £75 on a bit! No offence to the above poster as it has bought me around to a different way of thinking. So I emailed Neue Schule for advice, but I wanted to know what people thought of their bits, are they really worth the amount they ask? Do they make that much difference! They recommended their turtle top Pelham, and if not then a Waterford. I am going to try a Waterford from a hire place then take the above poster up on their offer if they have not sold beforehand. |
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