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Post by lucynlizzysmum on Jun 11, 2017 22:04:29 GMT
I am saddened to read today on the Guest section that the NNP at Derbyshire had been incorrectly transferred, very sad for all connections. But I am saddened even more at the attitude to the stewards. We don't show at HOYS level, but we hope to get there and are lucky enough to have been to RI a couple of times, but we on the whole enjoy our showing. Like everyone we have good days, we have bad days. But you know something - perhaps I am in the minority - but we are always grateful to the stewards and the officials who give up their time, and I would like to think that equally when I give up my time to go and steward and spend the day being pleasant to competitors, hopefully giving a little encouragement regardless of age to those who are feeling stressed, looking after the little ones who are desperate to please Mummy and Daddy standing in the wings, that those of you standing on the sidelines do not see me or my fellow stewards as stupid. Mistakes happen - "Guest Why" - do you never make a mistake in your daily life, please do not tell me that no, you never make a mistake as that does not happen I am afraid - we are all guilty of mistakes - it does not make the steward thick or stupid - and whilst that is not what you said, it is what you intimated.
Should people continue to slate the officials at our shows we will end up with no affiliated shows to go to as shows will stop or go unaffiliated, and if you continue to frighten off new stewards coming through eventually there will be no stewards to officiate at the classes as the volunteers who are the backbone of our clubs, shows and societies will find better things to do with their time. And whilst I stewarded yesterday, no I was not at Derbyshire Festival!
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Post by haggis on Jun 12, 2017 6:31:17 GMT
Very well said LLMUM !
i judge and steward, and can assure WHY that we do check and re check the marks and hand them to judge to check ,
people are going to have to lay off stewards - we get accused of being thick and fiddling the marks and for influencing the judges !
there is also a trend now with some shows NOT to offer or pay for a steward accommodation , this is being put forward at 1 of the late big county shows how appalling is this, Stewards do not get millage, they get a bottle of wine and a box of chocs , they work harder than a judge sometimes as they have to run the ring , check off who is allowed to enter, check for earrings etc, add marks , record results, and sort rosettes and dole out encouragement when a child is nervous!
some of our best Stewards who travel long distances to stand in a ring from 8 am until 4pm at lest deserve a bed for the night
if we are not careful our good stewards who are very experienced in the marks etc will just say sod it and then what will happen , i doesn't bear thinking about
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Post by the showing register on Jun 12, 2017 9:29:36 GMT
My personal view and not a reflection of any policy TSR has is that the stewards crisis is so deep mainly because of having to add up and be front line for marks. I would like to see someone take a grip on these qualifying classes and do away with the marks but instead have a set procedure for the class so every showing class was judged the same way.
My suggestion is
Go round with change rein
Pull in
Any shows not up to standard not stripped
No need to put them in a back line just dont take the saddle off
These animals are not then placed
Final walk round to prove manners
Final pull
Very transparent everyone can see what is going on
No b....y adding up !!
If a judge strips a naughty pony it is for all to see and competitors can take note for another day
Result a nice day out no headaches for stewards and judges
Gail C
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Post by honeypot on Jun 12, 2017 9:30:47 GMT
Well steward and I am not cross with them.
I work in a job with long hours and a lot of responsibility, and I make mistakes sometimes, I am human. The client, customer, or whatever you want to call them expects the same service, if something's not right I expect to be told and if something needs changing you change it, or apologies and try to correct the mistake. You do not blame the person making the complaint.
No one likes being told something is not right, me included, but I would rather know and have the chance to change if needed.
I have been in the box when the marks are being add up, every one tries but know one seems to have responsibility. I think the best thing to do would be to say that the placing are provisional until the marks are checked on computer or calculator, in the stewards office( by someone who is competent and only has that job to do) and the top awards are given out in the championship. It might even make the Championship more of an event.
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Post by chloesmum on Jun 12, 2017 10:15:04 GMT
Wow Gail - I know a lot of judges who would agree with that! Guess for the conformation judge they need to have trust then that only ponies that have gone well are presented to them for conformation or are you suggesting a return to one judge?
I reckon with plaited ponies that would be possible as numbers are so low but for the M&Ms it would be difficult (although usually there is only judge for LRSHT and they are big classes but of course they don't get stripped just a conformation mark).
Classes would probably run a lot quicker too - not stripping every pony and no endless adding up and checking!
On the other side of the fence some people may feel very aggrieved at paying such a big entry fee and not being stripped particularly if they feel they have gone well and see others being stripped that haven't - could lead to more complaints!!! Put your tin hat on in the Secretarys!!
Goes back to how ride is judged - I believe in a HOYS qualifier obvious mistakes should be penalised, trouble is there are not many that go REALLY badly.
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Post by the showing register on Jun 12, 2017 10:41:25 GMT
Two judges and nothing different to now judges have to have confidence that the other judge is fair and straight. It would do away with lack of trust amongst judges when one feels the other one has an agenda and is marking accordingly they would have to at least say why they liked an animal so much rather than hiding behind a mark.
And if they complained it would not be about stewards the judges decision is final.
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Post by the showing register on Jun 12, 2017 10:46:22 GMT
Actually chloesmum I think most animals go very poorly especially in the MM classes ... overbent , trotting too fast a lot of tension it is not only about bucking and wrong legs too many animals go incorrectly it would not be difficult to sort them out.
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Post by sjw87 on Jun 12, 2017 16:31:43 GMT
Actually chloesmum I think most animals go very poorly especially in the MM classes ... overbent , trotting too fast a lot of tension it is not only about bucking and wrong legs too many animals go incorrectly it would not be difficult to sort them out. I can't comment on m&m classes but absolutely agree 100% about way of going. Far too few people nowadays can actually recognise a horse going correctly which imo is what causes a lot of the issues when people think their horse went better than the judge thought it did. Unfortunately though, stewards and judges are not there to teach people how to school their horse, just judge it against the others. I've said it plenty of times but I still think that the best way to do it is to use marks but broken down further (eg. Manners, overall picture, conformation, way of going etc) but in reality that leaves even more room for calculation errors. Would help people work out where they are going wrong and can improve rather than just unjustifiably putting every judge in their 'little black book' as they didn't win under them. I for one absolutely respect and appreciate those who give up their time to judge and/or steward and just hate the judge/steward bashing trend that seems so commonplace nowadays. Sent from my SM-A300FU using proboards |
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Post by sjw87 on Jun 12, 2017 16:33:58 GMT
Gail - maybe a training day could be organised with competitors, judges and stewards trying different methods of judging to get feedback?
Sent from my SM-A300FU using proboards
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Post by the showing register on Jun 12, 2017 17:23:06 GMT
Gail - maybe a training day could be organised with competitors, judges and stewards trying different methods of judging to get feedback? Sent from my SM-A300FU using proboards Thats a good idea ! |
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Post by gillwales on Jun 13, 2017 6:00:03 GMT
I think it would be a good idea to get rid of marking as so much time is spent on double checking, then you get the social media circus of marks being challenged, the flow of classes are disrupted, however we would then go back to all of the suspicions of class fixing etc and if you only allowed certain ponies to strip then you get the " I have paid the same entry fee" syndrome; really there is no answer until everyone understands that this is a hobby and not a sport and showing is meant to be fun, and that the most important thing is that the horses and ponies go well and that you take home the pony you love the most. I have considered offering my time at some of the local shows but I read the posts on here and think why would I?
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Post by lucynlizzysmum on Jun 13, 2017 6:05:51 GMT
I think it would be a good idea to get rid of marking as so much time is spent on double checking, then you get the social media circus of marks being challenged, the flow of classes are disrupted, however we would then go back to all of the suspicions of class fixing etc and if you only allowed certain ponies to strip then you get the " I have paid the same entry fee" syndrome; really there is no answer until everyone understands that this is a hobby and not a sport and showing is meant to be fun, and that the most important thing is that the horses and ponies go well and that you take home the pony you love the most. I have considered offering my time at some of the local shows but I read the posts on here and think why would I? I stewarded on Saturday at a lovely championship show in the in-hands. As I was holding them before they did their trot down the long side there was the usual banter as everyone knew each other - but one competitor turned round and said "it doesn't matter what anyone else thinks, we all take the best one home" - I couldn't agree more, and that is what we always say too! |
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