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Post by millieshorse on Sept 9, 2018 20:25:53 GMT
Recently been talking about how shows this year have had much less turnout that in the past few years. Only last week there was no one entered in the hoys first ridden at bakewell. The last chance to qualify !! And then eventually only two in the class. Even local shows are getting much less turnout. I definitely think this is down to so many shows being on the same day people are so spoilt for choice that the amounts are too varied !
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Post by Philippa on Sept 10, 2018 5:51:45 GMT
You obviously didn't go yesterday. There may only have been 2 per entered the SPFR class but there were 13 forward!!!!
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Post by leevale on Sept 10, 2018 6:00:18 GMT
CHAPS had their biggest entries ever the week before, too.
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Post by Philippa on Sept 10, 2018 12:48:03 GMT
CHAPS had their biggest entries ever the week before, too. Coloured classes were huge yesterday too. |
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Post by whataday on Sept 10, 2018 13:01:26 GMT
Maybe Bakewell shows the problem there is with everyone chasing the hoys qualifiers ect, SPFR 13 forward, at the recent BSPS champs I watched the 138 open show pony class, just three came forward, all producers so even here a producer had to come bottom, for the last couple of years at the champs the numbers seem to be well down which is a shame as I am sure many remember the champs at Peterborough with two lines and you would be happy with any placing, anyhow roll on next year we shall be out enjoying ourselves come what may
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Post by Philippa on Sept 10, 2018 13:12:16 GMT
Maybe Bakewell shows the problem there is with everyone chasing the hoys qualifiers ect, SPFR 13 forward, at the recent BSPS champs I watched the 138 open show pony class, just three came forward, all producers so even here a producer had to come bottom, for the last couple of years at the champs the numbers seem to be well down which is a shame as I am sure many remember the champs at Peterborough with two lines and you would be happy with any placing, anyhow roll on next year we shall be out enjoying ourselves come what may Interesting you say that as we, as you know like to support our local agricultural shows as well as do the qualifiers. We are not big wig high flying producers. We have one pony who wears several hats yet on Saturday we went to P.enis.tone show and were told by the commentator of all people that there were plenty of ‘big’ shows for people like us to go to. So we’ve won the class the last 4 years now. Same child & pony combination. Hell she was only 4 the first time she won it and is only 7 now. We don’t do RC level with the pony but I’d like to think she’s allowed to go have some fun alongside the serious competitions we do. I was deeply insulted by the comments on Saturday. People pay to get into this show and if it was me I’d expect to see some quality. |
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sarahp
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Post by sarahp on Sept 10, 2018 14:52:21 GMT
I wonder if there will be a backlash at some point with people opting to have more fun and spend less money and time than chasing qualifiers, and was about to say before reading your post that I well remember, and competed, when to win a big class or even the Ch at a big agricultural show was a really big target and a big deal. Then they all turned into qualifiers so no big deal really, except to the winner who had their ticket, only a stepping stone instead of a main target. I well remember being thrilled to get Ch at the last ever RASE, an accolade I'd always coveted, but getting lots of muttering as he'd already qualified for whatever it was a qualifier for.
Where I part company with you Philippa, is why it is more fun to go to a show as you did than a bigger one to do the same sort of showing class? Why not do something different for fun - PC, dressage, jumping?
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Post by comanchediva on Sept 10, 2018 15:15:34 GMT
If we don't support our local agricultural shows we will lose them, FACT! Look at the problems Halifax has had due to the size of their ground; last year they moved the showing classes to the Friday and had to cancel due to lack of entries. Moved back to Saturday this year and from what I hear they had a good show and hopefully we'll be able to support them again next year.
We went to Pen istone for years and our now 8 year old stallion won his inhand large breeds class there 3 years on the trot; he was the first ever winner of the beautiful George Bashforth trophy and won it again as a 3 year old. He's qualified for HOYS this year so does that mean he can never go back? The agricultural shows are a fun day out, even more so if you have children. They usually have reasonable entry fees, a bit of prize money and lovely trophies and time for a walk round and an ice cream after your class and they need our support.
There are so many threads and posts moaning about people only chasing qualifiers we shouldn't be criticising people for supporting their local show and nor should the commentator!
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Post by Philippa on Sept 10, 2018 18:44:26 GMT
I wonder if there will be a backlash at some point with people opting to have more fun and spend less money and time than chasing qualifiers, and was about to say before reading your post that I well remember, and competed, when to win a big class or even the Ch at a big agricultural show was a really big target and a big deal. Then they all turned into qualifiers so no big deal really, except to the winner who had their ticket, only a stepping stone instead of a main target. I well remember being thrilled to get Ch at the last ever RASE, an accolade I'd always coveted, but getting lots of muttering as he'd already qualified for whatever it was a qualifier for. Where I part company with you Philippa, is why it is more fun to go to a show as you did than a bigger one to do the same sort of showing class? Why not do something different for fun - PC, dressage, jumping? The reason shows like this are more ‘fun’ are for reasons mentioned by CD in the post above. My hubby really doesn’t do ponies, he hates going to shows which are justhorses so yes as a family we do have a lovely varied day out and it’s usually on the doorstep. We also get prize money. Bonus. Regards doing other things. Well we do, we’ve finished our serious shows for the season now and pony will now do workers at countryside live and a bit of showjumping over winter to keep her ticking over. Just because we do some qualifiers doesn’t mean we don’t have fun doing other things. A SP season isn’t a 12 month season unlike m&m’s nowadays. |
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Post by Philippa on Sept 10, 2018 18:44:50 GMT
If we don't support our local agricultural shows we will lose them, FACT! Look at the problems Halifax has had due to the size of their ground; last year they moved the showing classes to the Friday and had to cancel due to lack of entries. Moved back to Saturday this year and from what I hear they had a good show and hopefully we'll be able to support them again next year. We went to Pen istone for years and our now 8 year old stallion won his inhand large breeds class there 3 years on the trot; he was the first ever winner of the beautiful George Bashforth trophy and won it again as a 3 year old. He's qualified for HOYS this year so does that mean he can never go back? The agricultural shows are a fun day out, even more so if you have children. They usually have reasonable entry fees, a bit of prize money and lovely trophies and time for a walk round and an ice cream after your class and they need our support. There are so many threads and posts moaning about people only chasing qualifiers we shouldn't be criticising people for supporting their local show and nor should the commentator! Absolutely this. |
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Post by millieshorse on Sept 10, 2018 18:50:20 GMT
If we don't support our local agricultural shows we will lose them, FACT! Look at the problems Halifax has had due to the size of their ground; last year they moved the showing classes to the Friday and had to cancel due to lack of entries. Moved back to Saturday this year and from what I hear they had a good show and hopefully we'll be able to support them again next year. We went to Pen istone for years and our now 8 year old stallion won his inhand large breeds class there 3 years on the trot; he was the first ever winner of the beautiful George Bashforth trophy and won it again as a 3 year old. He's qualified for HOYS this year so does that mean he can never go back? The agricultural shows are a fun day out, even more so if you have children. They usually have reasonable entry fees, a bit of prize money and lovely trophies and time for a walk round and an ice cream after your class and they need our support. There are so many threads and posts moaning about people only chasing qualifiers we shouldn't be criticising people for supporting their local show and nor should the commentator! Absolutely this. agree with this and exactly my point of not a lot of people are turning out to the smaller shows but where I am from many of the locals and agriculture shows are on the same days as many others in the area |
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Post by Philippa on Sept 10, 2018 19:20:47 GMT
This is the same everywhere though.
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sarahp
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Post by sarahp on Sept 10, 2018 20:52:13 GMT
You could just as well enjoy the other attractions of the show without actually showing though!
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Post by comanchediva on Sept 10, 2018 21:06:08 GMT
Sarahp the point is that if we don't support the equine section of these shows we will lose the classes!
The thread is about poorly supported shows and you're telling us not to show at said shows.
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Post by Philippa on Sept 11, 2018 5:32:59 GMT
What gets me is that people tell us to go do other things - WHY?  We enjoy showing, we don't moan about showing, we like to go to different shows but regardless of the show we ENJOY SHOWING!! Yes we do bits of other things over winter but if I'm honest it's cos that's all there is to do. We enjoy this bit of a change but can't wait for the season to start again. I'm glad we can support our smaller shows but if less people do this we will lose the classes there forever and we won't go to them if we don't take the pony. We will go to the caravan instead as it doesn't cost. We will have great fun there instead. SUPPORT YOUR LOCAL SHOWS OR LOSE THEM. |
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sarahp
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Post by sarahp on Sept 11, 2018 7:34:38 GMT
I'm not trying to have an argument, I just have different opinions which is surely allowable on here, but all the other stuff contributes to giving a child a much wider experience of different areas of riding and so improves all round riding skills. Having been mainly a dressage competitor (and not very good at it!) as well as breeding, I do notice these days that the standard of riding of many showing only riders these is basically incorrect and I do wonder if this is at least partly due to many now only showing rather than learning an all round and correct way of going in the first place.
My own daughter, now in her 40s, did mainly PC, which was huge fun with other children who became her friends and gave access to wonderful facilities not open to the general public, had lessons and hacked out over our wonderful commons here in the SE. She hunted from the age of about 10yo, a great riding improver. She did show a little but found it very constricting and boring compared to jumping and hunting. Once riding off lead she would not have gone back onto it to do showing classes under any circumstances - the possible exception being fancy dress when you never know what could happen!
I entirely see your point about entries in local shows, but had you thought that others not as focused on showing as yourself might avoid entering that show as they know that the same pony has won it for the last four years and will doubtless be there every year until the rider is too old? I used to help run an unaff charity show for the under 10s and depending on dates, some years it was conveniently placed to be used as a pipe opener for Windsor and we used to get some very smart ponies doing the LR who quite rightly took all the top places. If we had had them every year none of our normal, all round children would have bothered entering. Instead they would have carried on doing the SJ, WHP, handy pony and gymkhana as usual and learned to avoid showing.
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Post by Philippa on Sept 11, 2018 8:11:05 GMT
So a show I’ve attended since a child myself is one I should avoid just because we like to do things correctly?? The pony placed 2nd is owned and shown by people who also do hoys qualifiers.
I do t want to argue with anyone but the other side of the coin is that these people who maybe are t as focussed maybe need guidance as to what is required at a show like that to win. And this was an equitation class so regardless of how good or bad our pony may be and believe me she went shocking on Saturday it was on the rider!
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sarahp
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Post by sarahp on Sept 11, 2018 13:55:14 GMT
As I said, I don't want to argue, and have aired my views so will shut up now for the sake of peace and harmony!
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Post by janetbushell on Sept 11, 2018 16:12:46 GMT
I'm not trying to have an argument, I just have different opinions which is surely allowable on here, but all the other stuff contributes to giving a child a much wider experience of different areas of riding and so improves all round riding skills. Having been mainly a dressage competitor (and not very good at it!) as well as breeding, I do notice these days that the standard of riding of many showing only riders these is basically incorrect and I do wonder if this is at least partly due to many now only showing rather than learning an all round and correct way of going in the first place. My own daughter, now in her 40s, did mainly PC, which was huge fun with other children who became her friends and gave access to wonderful facilities not open to the general public, had lessons and hacked out over our wonderful commons here in the SE. She hunted from the age of about 10yo, a great riding improver. She did show a little but found it very constricting and boring compared to jumping and hunting. Once riding off lead she would not have gone back onto it to do showing classes under any circumstances - the possible exception being fancy dress when you never know what could happen! I entirely see your point about entries in local shows, but had you thought that others not as focused on showing as yourself might avoid entering that show as they know that the same pony has won it for the last four years and will doubtless be there every year until the rider is too old? I used to help run an unaff charity show for the under 10s and depending on dates, some years it was conveniently placed to be used as a pipe opener for Windsor and we used to get some very smart ponies doing the LR who quite rightly took all the top places. If we had had them every year none of our normal, all round children would have bothered entering. Instead they would have carried on doing the SJ, WHP, handy pony and gymkhana as usual and learned to avoid showing. I don't for one minute think you are trying to start an argument Sarahp, however the thread is about showing. Giving children a wider experience of owning & riding a pony is another topic IMO Times do change & to me the point of this thread is to emphasise that many local & agricultural shows, where many top ponies and riders learned their craft are often struggling to keep putting on the classes. There are many reasons for this including not keeping up with the current classes/options offered by the various societies, having a secretary who is not horsey & therefore doesn't always understand the ring layout, working in provision etc, having animal rings next to very unnerving main ring attractions etc But there is also the total focus by some competitors to aim only for RIHS, HOYS & Olympia, often to the detriment of the classes at the society championship shows & even some of the breed shows. This can't be good for any aspect of the equine world, regardless of your views on showing. If there is no market for the animals, they will not be bred & if they are many will not find buyers if they need to be ridden by children who will soon grow out of them, lose interest, have exams etc. Pony Club is age limited, as are many showing classes plus junior SJ & eventing. Several of today's top riders in other disciplines started within the ranks of the showing societies which actually offer more than "just" showing classes - look at the NPS dressage finals, the BSPS Gold Cup at Burghley. Jockeys, SJers, dressage riders, eventers often started in the show ring. It is all personal choice - no discipline is "better" than another, just preferred. Similar to yourself Sarah, my own children started out in PC with a 23yo pony between the three of them - but showing was what they loved having started by watching it at Royal Lancs on what was always "pony club day" & it gradually became more important to them than PC - their choice as I wasn't from a showing background. Some of their PC friends also moved into showing & some didn't but did it bother us, of course it didn't. If my grandchildren want to do PC then that will also be fine, as it will if they want to go showing or even not ride at all (well I'd be being economical with the truth if I didn't feel disappointed if none of them wished to ride!) Children are not children for long and should surely be happy at whatever riding they do or don't do & it is possible to combine several types of event if there is the time, willingness & finances to do so. Only one of my adult children still competes, but with a full time career & a family just fitting in riding is a juggling act. She enjoys showing, but is happy to attend any show. She has been lucky enough to compete at Olympia, RIHS & HOYS on several occasions so perhaps that's why "showing" as opposed to "qualifying" makes her happy. As I say each to their own. |
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sarahp
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Post by sarahp on Sept 11, 2018 21:11:40 GMT
janetbushell, Philippa said "We don’t do RC level with the pony but I’d like to think she’s allowed to go have some fun alongside the serious competitions we do."
I gave some suggestions for having fun, following the conversation along.
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Post by comanchediva on Sept 12, 2018 5:27:29 GMT
The show Philippa refers to is affiliated to Equifest, the FPS, the SPSS, CHAPS and holds a Horse of the Year Show Shire Horse qualifier.
There is also a fancy dress class, affiliated and unaffiliated showjumping, side saddle, hunters and donkeys. In other words something for everyone and a very prestigious qualifier.
The thing is and I've said this many times on here, many of today's competitors would rather go to the one off championship shows that pop up every year, not mind spending a fortune on entry fees providing there's an evening performance and a rosette the size of a dinner plate. Personally I much prefer the small agricultural shows for all the reasons I said in my post above. And it shouldn't matter what level you compete at the rest of the season.
At Pen is tone a few years ago a pony which was qualified for hoys took both the in hand and ridden championship.
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Post by gillwales on Sept 12, 2018 6:49:11 GMT
I will say this, it is noticeable in areas where producers use local shows for their top ponies, be it in hand or under saddle, these classes then decline in numbers over the years and you see those classes where people feel they stand a chance increase. Having said this it is my observation not an opinion. I believe this is why coloured classes have become so popular. This is no criticism of producers who work hard to get where they are. I did think it very sad when a pony who had won at HOYS was then trouped out at one of our local shows though.
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We enjoy showing, we don't moan about showing, we like to go to different shows but regardless of the show we ENJOY SHOWING!! Yes we do bits of other things over winter but if I'm honest it's cos that's all there is to do. We enjoy this bit of a change but can't wait for the season to start again. 
