Travel young foals and AI advice needed?

[Deleted]

Violet is due her foal heat next week and my stud guy, wants her in to be washed out - so she can be AIed next heat.

Will foalie be too young to travel?

I could get the vet in to wash Violet out instead, although this will be more expensive

What age do other people travel their foals?

[sarahp]

Well I'm the low tech native end of the breeding scale, and have never washed one out on the foal heat! When they went away to be covered I would travel them to the stud about a week before the season after the foal heat was due, often quite a distance and the foals were fine, by then about 3 weeks old. I always travelled them together loose, no hay nets or anything foal could get caught up in, and the foal normally lay down - don't worry, Violet wouldn't step on her! I'd guess though that because it is late in the season, the stud intend to bring her on again as soon as possible to AI her? The other consideration is how far away is she travelling? I have in the past taken foals to the vet hospital about 10 miles away on their day of birth with no ill effects on top of whatever they were going for anyway!

[vjc]

I am also non plused here why has she got to be washed out?? did she have a difficult birth? or was she very messy afterwards??? if you are not going to cover on the foal heat then by the time she comes round to her second post foaling heat she should be nice and clean anyway I am not a great believer in washing mares out unless they really need it! I have always found to much messing can actually be counter productive and in some cases put germs/ inbalances inside the uterus that were not there in the first place. I hope you do not think i am being a bit pushy, far from it, i am just concerned that you get the best for your mare.
As for traveling your foal most folk wait for the second heat so usually travel their foals around 3wks of age. Again i would be a little cautious of sending a very young foal to stud (my views only!) as they are so open to infection in the first couple of weeks of life and with all the comings and goings of horses at stud there is a greater risk to a foal than at home. If a mare has foaled down at a stud and stays to be covered then that is differant as they will have the antibodies in their blood from their moms stay there.

[holiday]

Totally agree with vjc unless she has a uterine infection there should be no need to wash out. I also would not send a young foal to stud but we are lucky our vets come to the stud we work with which is only 10 mins up the road so we do walk in, I do travel foals for foal heat occasionally ie a late mare that I want to try to move forward, and Arthur has had to travel to our stud from 3 days old as he had to come with me so he could be fed. But he was covered with antibiotics from day one.

I will only use AI or walk in coverings for my mares as wont send anything away not even my mares!!!! They are allowed to stay at the stud we work with but that is limited!!!! And only because I trust them completely!!!!!! We can pick bugs and viruses up just taking the walk ins!!!!

[Deleted]

OK - here goes with the explanation..... I dont know if any of this is right or wrong, but its the advice I have been given - which is why I would like you guys to tell me if its not a good plan?

1. I only have frozen semen available. I paid £950 for top dressage horse chilled semen last year. First attempt didnt take. All went well, but she had a reaction to the semen once she came home, which would have effectively finished the pregnancy. Stud man said next time, he would treat her with antibiotics after she was AIed, which would prevent this from happening again.

2nd attempt - stallion had gone off competing and only frozen Semen left. Due to the complications of getting timings spot on with frozen semen - Violet had to stay overnight at the stud to be continuously scanned - so that the right time to inseminate could be accurate. She hated staying overnight and despite the fact that she had was fully in season when I left her, with a lovely big follicle, she totally switched off and the follicle shrunk and dissapeared. Her season shut down. She came home. This happened 3 more times, exactly the same....... The frozen semen was therefore never used and the owner of the stallion agreed I could have chilled semen the following year. She then walked in to the stud, was covered once by the studs showjumping stallion, given antibiotics and later scanned in foal.....hence beautiful bubba.

2. The owner of the first stallion - then sold him! I wrote, telephoned etc etc but they never answered me. I had wanted a refund for the £950 semen I had bought...

3. As a last resort, I contacted the stud, that did my AI work and YIPEE, they still had my frozen Semen. The man said - As we knew it might be difficult to get Violet in foal with this frozen AI, he wanted to get things totally right the first time. He said to bring her in on her foal heat (this is walk in - walk out) to be washed out. Then she would go back to be AIed the following season, with foalie and her staying..... The chances are, she will switch off again, although the hope is she will be happier cos her baby will be with her?

Now- if I had my wish, Violet would be AIed at home BUT the stud who has my frozen semen dont do this. With it being frozen Semen - not sure any vet could?

Its all so complicated - its worrying me to death....... I would NEVER buy semen again - that wasnt chilled, cos frozen seems to be mission impossible! I was a novice though and didnt realise the implications of frozen semen

Advice please?

[stormyskies]

i have no idea about Ai but i know our vet does froxen semen so how come your stud vet cant use frozen semen the stud man has ti AI violet at home??

i travelled mare and foal to vets this year at 24 hrs old. was ill with worry!! bedded trailer down with thick straw and left them both loose. mare turned round while travellng along roads trying toi follow foal but all was fine and she came to no harm.

i would think twice about sending a young foal to a stud though as for reasons others have said, e.g. infections

[sarahp]

My mares normally turned round immediately once in the trailer as they preferred travelling backwards!

In general, fresh semen is easier than chilled which is easier than frozen. My vets try to inseminate with frozen within two hours either side of ovulation, which explains the need for frequent scanning, easier in a vet hospital, AI centre of some sort or whatever than at home when vet has to come to you, although I know some vets do. Against that, frozen is normally very carefully collected, stored and transported in special containers so should be of as good quality as possible. Chilled can be more open to problems of management depending on who has collected and treated it, and vagaries of the transport system used - not a good plan for it to get too warm! My daughter used some chilled a few years ago with no result - I have heard on the grapevine since that all mares who went to the stud for natural cover were in foal but none of those using chilled semen. They then sold the stallion and she lost her money as you did LP but had no frozen to fall back on!

When I sent my mares away it was to D stallions and to run out 24/7, no extras! It did mean I knew or could find out easily the reputation of the stud and was very happy with all the studs I used - I did choose carefully! The only time I had a really major traumatic time both for the mare, foal at foot and myself was with a sport horse stud, she had to go at the last minute (long story) and not my area of knowledge. Masses of vet work done too.

"Reaction to the semen" and using antibiotics in this way is something I haven't come across, only using oxytocin to get rid of any accumulated fluid - one D mare of mine years ago needed this to get in foal, and I've tried it this year on my EMS mare, yet to find out if it's worked!

[Deleted]

I just dont see how a vet can do frozen AI from home? They have to be scanned round the clock, so unless the vet was practically going to move in, how would it work?

If it can be done - I would definately be going for it?

Chilled AI yes - but frozen? Can it really be done at home?

[sarahp]

Yes I know, I haven't done it, mine go into hospital for AI'ing but know it is done. Maybe they are extremely good at managing and organising timing of ovulation? Have pm'd you.

[Deleted]

thank you sarahp - you are a star xxx

We just spoke to the stud, who are storing our semen. They dont want to wash Violet out after all, just asked to see her at 25 days, to scan and make a plan then. Walk in walk out. Foalie should be better able to travel then and its only a 15 min journey at maximum.

I will investigate the people you have told me about - many thanks xxxx

[holiday]

It would be near on impossible to use frozen at home as you have to scan so frequently. It would only be if you were lucky enough to scan at point of ovulation at the time the vet came, which can happen occasionally. It isnt the handling and insemination it is the timing, as the semen can be moved in a container to the mare.


If we had a mare prone to infection we would inseminate then flush 4 hours later, after which we would treat with antibiotics the next day then oxytocin the following.

I would always tie up the mare to travel and leave the foal loose, however we tie to an easily breakable string on the off chance the foal got stuck. My foals get travelled from around 24 days and all load really well by the time they have been on and off the lorry or trailer and we have no problems with loading once older.

I personally dont use frozen which cuts my stallions down but I dont want my mares and foals elsewhere either!!!

[Deleted]

Holiday - I agree with you. Frozen semen is something I will avoid like the plague in future, cos I dont want to leave my mare somewhere else either. When us Novice breeders enter into these things, there are no warnings about the implications of using Frozen as opposed to chilled or fresh.

[sarahp]

It can come in handy though for stallions that have been gelded, sold, died or are competing and can travel far better than chilled. And preserved for years if necessary, in the case of rare breeds for example.

[Deleted]

Yes - definately sarahp AND at the end of the day - as the stallion I purchased the semen from is now a) sold b) not in the country anymore and c) possibly gelded - I would have totally lost my money......

At least with the frozen semen - Violet still has a chance of getting in foal by him.