fat ponies

[maninthemirror]

I saw so many FAT ponies at the weekend I thought judges were meant to be doing something about it? The ones I saw were mainly heading the lineups

[dun4u]

If I have overweight ponies in my class I will tell the competitors that I dont approve and place them accordingly, but it needs ALL judges to do this, esp. those judging cobs, hunters and youngstock classes.

[tooshy]

it should be fit not fat........

[toffertonstud]

Fat ponies and horses are a bit of a sad site at many shows - often a judge will refer to a non-fat pony as 'immature' - but it such an ongoing debate regarding the long term health of a grossly overweight animal and I cannot see how it can resolved really!

Immature - if need be - and healthy is the option I would always go for - a nice covering of flesh but in proportion to the skeletal frame of the animal.

Its ok saying that its the judges fault for placing these animals but it is the exhibitors fault for keeping the circle going by putting grossly overweight animals up for inspection in a class.

Many years a go I used to show hunters in-hand and gave up because of the 'immature' versus overweight problem - and here I am again showing Dartmoor ponies this time, but I hope my ponies will be considered for their good conformation,bone,movement and trueness to type. Not how fat they are, because I intend for my ponies to go on to have a long, productive ridden career as well after they do their bit in-hand to get ring experience.

Just my opinion of course................

[lincolstables]

Oh sorry I didnt realise there were judges on here!!!!!

[Guestless]

lincolstables said:

Oh sorry I didnt realise there were judges on here!!!!!

What a silly comment. Of course there are judges (including some very well known people) on here - some of them are able to look beyond the negative views of others appreciate the fact that a site like this has a place in showing today.

[maninthemirror]

toffertonstud said:

Its ok saying that its the judges fault for placing these animals but it is the exhibitors fault for keeping the circle going by putting grossly overweight animals up for inspection in a class.

I see what you mean, it is a viscious circle of people showing the fat animals and if there are only fat animals in the class, the judges have to place them, then this leads other people to beleive that to head the lineups their ponies need to be fat too

[dun4u]

It would take a brave Judge to actually TELL an exhibitor that their animal is overweight. There is a very high risk of verbal abuse from some competitors towards Judges who have the courage of their own convictions, and the whole public scene can be very unpleasant. These competitors are virtually in denial - dealing out the same old argument - 'It's condition, not fat'! As I said in a previous post, it needs ALL Judges to be of the same mind on this matter, and I don't think that will ever happen, which I think is very sad.

[ponygirl]

I know a judge who did this to a competitor in a very important qualifier. To be fair that pony came back much lighter the next, look a completely different pony and had a fab year - so can be done (although I'm sure they weren't too happy about it at the time).

Toffertonstud: I believe the judges do have a responsibility here - if they continue to put fat ponies at the top of the line then that's how people think they have to show them to do well. Until judges have the courage of their convictions to put fat ponies down the line nothing will change.

[flashthecash]

Well it was nice to see non-fat horses at the Northern on thursday. Good to see that people are taking note, of what has been said in the mags. I can't comment on the other days as we were not there. Better to see nice horses carrying less weight though
Well done you lot.. you get my vote

[solitaire]

Well i met a very brave judge who told a person who is well known for her huge and badly behaved youngsters - nice ponies just grossly overweight and out of their brains on hard food that her ponies were obese, badly behaved and candidates for laminitis she finished by telling the exibitor that "it was not a fatted calve market" I was very impressed exhibitor was speechless

[pony]

It's just a shame when you have a fit nicely covered animal to be told that it needs some more weight on when you take it in the ring.

[jdd]

silversox said:

It would take a brave Judge to actually TELL an exhibitor that their animal is overweight. There is a very high risk of verbal abuse from some competitors towards Judges who have the courage of their own convictions, and the whole public scene can be very unpleasant. These competitors are virtually in denial - dealing out the same old argument - 'It's condition, not fat'! As I said in a previous post, it needs ALL Judges to be of the same mind on this matter, and I don't think that will ever happen, which I think is very sad.

I don't see why they seem brave enough to tell an exhibitor that there animal is not carrying enough condition.

[interestingly]

At every show I've been to this season, competitiors HAVE been told their ponies are too fat and some even have been accordingly dropped in the class. It seems the message is getting through now just have to see if the competitors being told do anything about it.

[solitaire]

Great about time

[fjudge]

Don't think i saw 1 fat animal yesterday

But for some, they may not be "fat" like you say. For example - my 15hh shp is ID x welsh, so she is never going to be a skinny shp!

[jdd]

Trouble is often they are not fat in the belly but show signs of long term over weightness where people have tried to increase condition with fat rather than muscle- fat stores on neck, shoulder, bum. Can often be easy to see as goes like cellulite you can see lumpiness under the skin where fat is being stored.

I am really pleased that the showing world is trying to change this trend and encourage more awareness. Long may it continue

[bsps judge]

jdd said:

Trouble is often they are not fat in the belly but show signs of long term over weightness where people have tried to increase condition with fat rather than muscle- fat stores on neck, shoulder, bum. Can often be easy to see as goes like cellulite you can see lumpiness under the skin where fat is being stored.

I am really pleased that the showing world is trying to change this trend and encourage more awareness. Long may it continue

I have recently told a competitior that i had to drop their animal because it was too fat. I do think that the problem with some judges is that they dont know how to speak to people properly. I told the young lady that i liked her pony but unfortunately on this occasion it was carrying too much weight, and she agreed. Competitors are not stupid, but unfortunately some of these animals live on nothing, and i do understand that it is quite hard to keep the weight down on some. I am sure there are plenty of people out there with the same problem. Thankyou for reading....

[loganbenson]

i took my lad in a youngstock class yesterday (3 year old and under), it was a mixed class, i myself was showing my section c colt who is 2 this time. The first pony pulled in was a section a colt, who was very plump, he looked very fat and over weight, and i was not the only person to comment on this. He was a lovely moving pony.. but so chubby :0( . The judge commented that my boy was stunning but needed to more mature a bit more, which is fair comment, but i dont believe in pumping him silly full of food, he is on good grass and has a bit of breakfast and tea, but he will mature and fill out in time. My section d was just the same, as a four year old he looked very leggy etc, now 2 years on he has developed etc and looiks a complete different animal.

Im new, but i did find this post very interesting.

Rachel .x.

[julie]

we have a 5 yr old sec b mare who is on rubbish grass and who stands in all day long with nothing as I am worried her crest seems hardish - but I'd like more bottom on her which will only come with work...am I doing the right thing by my regime? I think maybe I need to find the big crest thread again...

[pimms]

actually, my pony was pulled in 3rd at berkshire dropper to 4th and the judge said she loved him and would have had him higher but he had too much weight on. i didnt take offence as that was her job, our pony doesnt eat anything ( has the same problem as me just looks at a choc bar and it goes straight to my hips) so i cracked on and hacked it out miles everyday and put the extra work in .................. now he s got his rihs and hoys ticket and he's 4 ! thanks to that judge.

[johnwayne]

pimms said:

actually, my pony was pulled in 3rd at berkshire dropper to 4th and the judge said she loved him and would have had him higher but he had too much weight on. i didnt take offence as that was her job, our pony doesnt eat anything ( has the same problem as me just looks at a choc bar and it goes straight to my hips) so i cracked on and hacked it out miles everyday and put the extra work in .................. now he s got his rihs and hoys ticket and he's 4 ! thanks to that judge.

That's a great story. Well done, and it's given me hope for my fattie too!

[eleybee]

I have been trying for years to get weight off my sec a because they say he is two fat. Hes worked most days and stays the same. so now i believe its how he is ment to be and he only as a hand full of chaff with garlic a day.

[footie]

no hard food, no hay, sharing paddock with another, grass but neither lush, long nor masses of it. No rug on so having to stay warm.................................but still too fat. My problem is that I am talking about a 3 y.o. filly who is being shown occasionally in hand as an education. I am of the opinion that it is perhaps not right to keep youngsters who are not in "work" shut in and/or with no food as I think that long hours of boredom breed bad habits, physically and mentally. However, as you cannot work them (highlands like some other large M&M's are very slow maturing) yet how on earth do we combat the fat? Any views welcomed as I totally agree that fat is bad and can only lead to ailments in later life and at the moment the "L" word is far too prevalent. Look forward to hearing other's opinions......

[abe]

I think that judges need to be educated on this subject. Although it is pleasing to hear that some judges are acting on the issue by putting fat horses down, it is important that they are knowledgable in the correct condition for the various breeds in order to do so. I was in a worker class earlier this year on my sec C who has plenty of bone but was slightly under condition at the begining of the year due to a winter being roughed off. Was pulled in sencond to a connemara which had great big fat pockets all over its rump, back and front. It had a massive crest and I think that perhaps the owner had been trying to make it look more substantial as it was rather small and light for its breed. The judge kept the connemara in top and gave it its qualifier. He said to the rider that he would have liked to have seen it carrying MORE weight as it looked rather light for a highland!!! Needless to say I was rather gobsmacked to hear this but I was even more astonished when the judge got to me and told me my pony was too fat!!! Not only was my pony not carrying enough weight, on the day she was tucked up as well due to stressing in the box! Talking to the rider of the connemara/'highland', she was really upset about the judges comments saying that she had been loading the weight on her pony giving it ad-lib haylage, keeping it in all day and 3 times a day feed!!! She obviously wasn't aware of the correct condition for her horse and you would have thought that the judges should be guiding her in the right direction!!!

[solitaire]

Its worrying that the judge thought the connie was a highland and was judging a qualifying class as well - what was the qualifier for??

[sash]

What i find really dissapointing is, i have a potentially very good open WHP who i am eventing this season in our first open we came 2nd not bad... and as i am doing pre novice and novice BE she is extremely fit, therefore i have been told that i would be laughed at in the ring beacuse she is not well "covered" i fond this very dissapointing as the whole point of a worker is that of staying a day out hunting...could a well "covered" pony last a WHOLE day?
in my opinion no. but others might think different.

[buster]

Sadly i have seen both sides, fat ponies suffering chronic laminitis, and people starving or overworking their ponies because of previous judges comments about them. Surely a horse should be at the correct weight for the job it is doing, a cart horse will never be the same weight as a pleasure horse, and a racehorse will never be the same size as hunter, judges should be carefully trained in the correct weight for their type of horse.

[also judge]

silversox said:

It would take a brave Judge to actually TELL an exhibitor that their animal is overweight.

I dont have a problem doing this...I judged a youngstock class and there was a rising 2 yr old highland..which would not look out of place as a 4yr old!

Upon closer inspection, you could see the cellulite on his rump, his inner thighs and neck.

manners etc were impeccable (in hindsight this could just have been it was too fat to move or protest)
She was not in the placings and questioned why..

I told her that for a 2 year old he was too well covered and she is seriously risking his health, she replied "he is a highland" I told her thats fine, but let his bone determine how big he is NOT the feed

she didnt know what to say! I went on to say - if you cannot see that this pony has a very poor condition score you need to look closer and do some work with him to work it off..i.e walking out in hand. I used to with my welsh colt..he was as fit as a fiddle as a yearling!

[MELANIE]

"I think that judges need to be educated on this subject. Although it is pleasing to hear that some judges are acting on the issue by putting fat horses down, it is important that they are knowledgable in the correct condition for the various breeds in order to do so."

I couldn't agree more with this. I recently watched at a local show where an obviously inexperienced judge seemed to be obsessed by the issue of weight, but mistook a heavier, big boned pony in good condition for fat.
In a couple of open classes there was a native cob type, full of quality, well covered but obviously fit with good muscle tone, and beautifully produced.

This pony was put 2nd in a large ridden BTO class to a very lean, narrow pony, number tied on with string, stable marks on both hind legs. Judge remarked to the rider of the beautiful native pony - "Your pony is too fat"

The same thing happened in the best conditioned class. This time it seemed that the native pony was still "too fat" and the judge prefered "the markings" on a pretty little Welsh type pony. After hearing this, one of the competitors pointed out that the Welsh pony still had its winter coat, and as it was a best conditioned class, what difference did the ponies' colour or markings make? Judge replies - Well I hadn't noticed its winter coat, but it will be lovely when it loses it.

This was quite funny really, as all the spectators as well as competitors could hear what the judge was saying, and with every remark she made it became more obvious that she didn't really know what she was judging, let alone how to do it!


Needless to say, the well turned out native pony went on to win its breed in-hand and ridden classes with a more experienced judge later in the day.