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Post by Yogananda on Apr 24, 2011 16:35:08 GMT
Hi all, I am struggling a little with our lead rein pony. In walk he holds himself beautifully, is very forward and goes nicely on the bit, however when we go into trot he seems to turn into a bit of a donkey  and sticks his head right out and will look at everything apart from the way in which he is meant to be going. I have worked hard with my daughter to take her hands off her balance strap and at last she will trot without holding on (this has taken a lot of work  phew) and before he held his head a little too high but the overall picture was a lot pleasanter. Would some more ground work be in order? My daughter will be out of lead rein at the end of the year and we are hoping he will be able to take her into first ridden, he has a lovely attitude if a little green at the moment. Any help would be much appreciated as though I have a lot of experience, when I was younger I went striaght onto 12.2s and missed out on the lead rein. Thank you |
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Simmy
Junior Member
The imperfect pursuit of perfection<3
Posts: 147
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Post by Simmy on Apr 25, 2011 20:23:56 GMT
Have you tried him with the side reins on him at home? maybe just a couple of practices at home with that on might help. (I'm not good at this) LOL xx
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Post by showingfanatic on Apr 25, 2011 20:40:20 GMT
I know a lot of people will disagree but I would long rein and use side reins.
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Post by LucyHebditch on Apr 25, 2011 20:43:22 GMT
Have you got an older capable jockey around to help?
It's very hard for the little ones to hold together a pony all of the time, however if you have someone to help you school him, your daughter will find it much easier for the lead rein.
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Post by rightrein92 on Apr 25, 2011 20:51:24 GMT
id pop some side reins on just for schooling, or just hacking out so the ponys used to holding his head correctly x
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Post by LucyHebditch on Apr 25, 2011 21:12:00 GMT
I have a feeling that everyone is going to say side reins, they are all well and good for a quick fix, but do you want a false outline?
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Post by bemused on Apr 26, 2011 5:45:42 GMT
Definately long rein - without side reins. This will enable adult (soft) hands to educate the pony. Side reins are a quick fix that "set" the pony and can often worsen the problem. Also lunging with a pessoa will help.
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Post by Yogananda on Apr 26, 2011 7:58:59 GMT
Thanks peeps, unfortuantely I dont have an older jockey and I am still a little heavy at 9 stone 12 to get on him. I do have side reins but I don't really want to use them as I believe for him that they would only assist him when they were on and he would evert back as soon as they were off. I will start doing more lunging and long reining, I think I have been focusing more on getting Lotties riding better, so I will do this on alternate days.
You can see that in walk he does carry himself nicely, so hopefully with some long reining and some work with a pessoa he shoudl improve in the trot.
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Post by S4rahP on Apr 26, 2011 9:25:11 GMT
My lead rein was/can be a bit like this and I can't put side reins on her as she has had problems in the past with her back (probably caused by being in a false outline in the past, she's 18) and I wont risk hurting the pony.
If I long rein her or hold the reins she goes into an outline really easily and is very light on the contact so I have been working hard on getting my daughter to ride properly and not just sitting pretty on board. Its hard work with a lead rein but we now win equitation classes as well as lead rein so we are very happy with how we are getting on - Good luck, there is no quick fix unfortunatley.
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Post by kidside on Apr 26, 2011 10:14:23 GMT
I have had the same issue with my lead rein I have spent quite a bit of time long reining and what a massive improvement, I also use the lungie bungie ( not with long reining) twice a week on lunge my daughter is 3 and just starting at home she is now able to hold him in the correct position in walk as before it was a no go
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Post by pencaedu on Apr 26, 2011 11:18:16 GMT
Surely the correct head position comes from the hind quarters being engaged?  Don't they work FORWARD INTO a contact, rather than being pulled back into the contact, which just compresses the neck. |
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Post by S4rahP on Apr 26, 2011 14:09:32 GMT
Surely the correct head position comes from the hind quarters being engaged? Don't they work FORWARD INTO a contact, rather than being pulled back into the contact, which just compresses the neck. I agree with your statement but it is hard getting a 5 year old to do this. With some of lead reins (IMO and from what I have been advised to do!) they train them without a jockey and tie their heads in with side reins to the saddle and crupper attached to saddle. Some dont track up as they can't use their back propperly and have the dip in the neck after the withers.....but they win their classes?? Awful and I dont think its worth it. Id rather have a happy pony and one that tracks up and moves forward. |
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Post by Yogananda on Apr 26, 2011 14:26:06 GMT
I also agree, however my daughter just does not have the length or strength in her legs to be able to push him forward. I would rather train him with Lottie riding as he is also to be used as her first ridden pony come next year when she is out of the lead rein class, unfortunately we just havent had the time with her coming into riding late to be able to take the lead rein training forward.
I am loath to use side reins, not just for my above reason but that I would rather not use them at all if possible, just personal choice. Solo does use his back end extremely well on the lunge and maybe with time and lotties leg growth he will come together a bit more. I would just like the overall picture to look better and just want some tips for this, I am not into quick fixes as inevitably they come back to bite you on the bum!
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Post by kidside on Apr 26, 2011 19:15:33 GMT
Surely the correct head position comes from the hind quarters being engaged? Don't they work FORWARD INTO a contact, rather than being pulled back into the contact, which just compresses the neck. I agree with your statement but it is hard getting a 5 year old to do this. With some of lead reins (IMO and from what I have been advised to do!) they train them without a jockey and tie their heads in with side reins to the saddle and crupper attached to saddle. Some dont track up as they can't use their back propperly and have the dip in the neck after the withers.....but they win their classes?? Awful and I dont think its worth it. Id rather have a happy pony and one that tracks up and moves forward. ditto I agree but with the little jockeys they have very little leg power, however my pony is quite forward going and walks on quite correctly on the lead therefore with the correct contact he falls into an outline, however not tried trot yet  |
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Post by cheetham on Apr 27, 2011 6:20:07 GMT
morning all,
when long reining a lead rein pony, how do you all do your ponies....do you attach the long reins to the bit and through a roller and walk and trot behind useing voice commands,any help would be nice,thanks..
kidside-your post was helpful,what is a lungie bungie and how does it work,is it a lot more flexible than the side reins..
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Post by kidside on Apr 27, 2011 12:13:40 GMT
morning all, when long reining a lead rein pony, how do you all do your ponies....do you attach the long reins to the bit and through a roller and walk and trot behind using voice commands,any help would be nice,thanks.. kidside-your post was helpful,what is a lungie bungie and how does it work,is it a lot more flexible than the side reins.. I long rein by attaching to bit and through either roller or stirrup irons whilst they are pushed to top of leathers without a rider and then walk or run behind using voice commands, if mine wont respond to voice I flick him with side of lunge to make him walk on but he is very good with voice commands now, the lungie bungie is a lot more flexible than side reins it does not hold them in a false position its not tight and restrictive, if you google libbys lungie bungie you can see pics, is can be used whilst riding or lunging |
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Post by S4rahP on Apr 27, 2011 14:56:39 GMT
I've got a bungie lungie if anyone wants to buy one off me, too big for my pony as she's tiny 11hh. I think they are £30. So I would want £15 + P&P. Have a look on the webpage for them.
As for lead rein I work the pony next to me without a jockey or lead and use voice commands to make her follow me and turn, have a stick in your hand to help slow and turn, I find this makes her sharper and I long rein to help with the contact and outline.
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Post by cheetham on Apr 27, 2011 20:17:35 GMT
thanks guys..just going to google libbys lungie bungie..and have a look..
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Post by lils on Apr 27, 2011 20:31:31 GMT
thanks guys..just going to google libbys lungie bungie..and have a look.. dont know how much they are at Libbys, but i use a really cheap shires lunge bungee |
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caz77
Junior Member
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Post by caz77 on Apr 27, 2011 20:59:32 GMT
I think you have 3 choices with a lead rein pony.
1 - best option. school pony well, either bigger jockey/ long reins. Long-reining is an amazing solution. It works far better than you ever imagine it will. Lots of transitions on the lunge with CORRECTLY fitted (ie loose-ish) side-reins helps too. Get child to standard where hands and legs are good enough to acheive outline. This was the route I took but tbh honest most kids (mine included) are nearly out of class by the time they can do this and these days ponies in an outline, even a false one beat the ones that aren't. Even if your child can do it just in walk but not in trot you will probably always be beaten by ponies in that stay false outlines for their whole show.
2 - as above but have child hold notch in reins, touch reins to front of saddle etc, some other 'help' for child to keep hands still. IMO a fair compromise as really it is a bit of a stretch to think that a lead-rein jockey can actually ride a pony forward into a true outline with no help at all.
3 - strap pony in very tight side-reins for hours every day in the stable, on the lunge etc until it goes like that ALL THE TIME, even loose in the field. At a show warm up for hours with said side-reins on as tight as possible. Only remove these side-reins as you are actually walking in the ring entrance. Then have child simply sit on top of pony. Despite fact that pony can't actually use it's back properly any more or track up the red ribbons will pile up. This happens. And these ponies often beat the poor kids trying their hearts out to actually RIDE.
I have had lead-rein ponies and jockeys for years. It is a dis-heartening class for those who believe in 'proper' schooling and riding as often this is not rewarded by judges. But take heart from the fact that if you teach your children and ponies properly they might not do amazing in lead-rein but they will have had a great head-start once they are older and in a class where correct riding and schooling really matter.
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Post by cheetham on Apr 27, 2011 21:04:01 GMT
thankyou,good points.........i have googled libbys lungie bungie and not a great deal came up actually,more where i could buy one from than details about it..
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Post by amumwithapony on Apr 28, 2011 6:14:32 GMT
Good post Caz77!
My L/R pony has always been slightly pokey nosed in trot but TBH I'm not really that bothered. My daughter loves her and I love her and at 4/5/6/7 years old what child can be expected to push a pony from behind into their hands and hold an outline? I see plenty of adults and older children who struggle with this concept let alone a baby!
Whilst it would be nice in theory to have a perfectly schooled L/R pony who holds itself correctly at all times in reality its very difficult to find one who firstly has been schooled correctly and can go in a natrual outline at all times, regardless of what the jockey is asking and secondly that has not been oversharpeped by an adult. We are currently schooling my mare off the lead as she has only ever done L/R and we are being very careful not to make her too responsive to little flappy legs.
TBH whilst I'm sure that it would be nice to have the money and inclination to do big L/R classes and qualifiers for all the big shows my daughter is happier going local where she can do young handler, bonny pony and prettiest eyes classes as well as the L/R class. And at that level as long as your pony behaves, your jockey can do a few up/downs and you all look reasonably clean and tidy I don't think it really matters that much whether my pony goes slightly pokey nosed.
I'd rather concentrate on getting my daughter to have nice, quiet steady hands before I start confusing her with trying to ride the pony into a contact, without overbending but engaging the rear, but still keeping her hands nice and still. And doing nice up/downs. And steering. And smiling. And concentrating on the judge and other competitors. And having fun!
Just let them be children enjoying their ponies and having a bit of fun with them. Plenty of time for them to worry about other stuff later! ;D ;D
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Post by sellyblue on Apr 28, 2011 6:19:30 GMT
Amwap couldn't agree more need a like button!
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Post by cheetham on Apr 28, 2011 8:11:15 GMT
thankyou amwap,some of us can think along the same lines...
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Post by nici on Apr 28, 2011 11:14:21 GMT
caz77 and amwap - I like your posts a lot, and just wish that more judges would take this view, both in LR and FR classes.
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Post by hollypony on Apr 28, 2011 15:38:37 GMT
caz and amwap Fantastic comments XXXXX
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Post by S4rahP on Apr 28, 2011 19:21:59 GMT
caz77 I couldnt of explained it better! exactly how I feel and its fruistraiting, it is the judges that need to change, I had this arguement over the knotted reins i.e. what on earth will that solve?!?! I think they need to look beyond this, but this is never gunna happen, shame.
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Post by Wishiwasrich on Apr 29, 2011 10:53:03 GMT
some brilliant comments there - not enough focus on what is best for pony and rider in the long term. x
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2011 11:40:12 GMT
I long rein mine all the time, I also use a bungee, a great tool in the right hands.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2011 20:42:15 GMT
I think lunging with the pessoa is really good! It helped me alot with my old LR/FR!! x
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and sticks his head right out and will look at everything apart from the way in which he is meant to be going. I have worked hard with my daughter to take her hands off her balance strap and at last she will trot without holding on (this has taken a lot of work 
phew) and before he held his head a little too high but the overall picture was a lot pleasanter.
Don't they work FORWARD INTO a contact, rather than being pulled back into the contact, which just compresses the neck.
