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Post by LSC on Oct 27, 2009 0:39:02 GMT
This is a request to 'certain' show organisers. I am a panel judge and course bulider. I have had an enjoyable season appart from one thing~I'm still waiting for 2 shows to pay me. 1 was in June, 1 in Sept. I dont charge the earth, all I ask is that my fuel is paid for. I have sent email after email, letters, phone calls and still no cheque. Now the amounts we are talking wont pay for a holiday to Blackpool let alone Barbados, but I would still like them. One particular organisers, told me earlier this evening that the show didnt make a profit, so none of the judges have been paid. The other one has said it was posted a month ago. Guess what, it hasnt arrived. Sorry but this isnt acceptable. As both shows advertise on here, I know you will read this. I would appreciate if you would please pay what you owe me (and other judges). I havent, yet, said which shows they are. I will see if this does the trick first
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Post by bemused on Oct 27, 2009 7:20:39 GMT
My friend won quite a lot of prize money at a very well known show. The show will not be paying any of it - said they didn't have enough money. Why put up such big prizes if they are unable to pay out. Like LSC my friend had used diesel money, entry fees etc, although I do think judges, stewards should be paid first. Is it the same shows I wonder? and can anything be done about this?
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Post by ladybird on Oct 27, 2009 7:50:26 GMT
wrong wrong wrong, of course LSC you should be paid. You need to be re-imbursed at the very least. Even if i could (?!!) I wouldnt be a judge for anything, I take my hat of to those (especially at the more local level) who stand in blazing sun/pouring rain for hours, giving up their time, and im sure at times not appreciated and grumbled at, and if theyre lucky given a bottle of wine at the end of an exhausting day. Its not acceptable not to be paid what was agreed let alone having to ask and ask for it. Bemused, i feel very sorry for your friend. I hope she receives what she has worked so hard for.
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Post by thecremellosociety on Oct 27, 2009 8:34:25 GMT
You should of course be paid and unless anything paperwork wise goes astray in the post Derby County Show are paid out about a month after show day at the lastest ( to coincide wuth a finance meeting that does check the milages ) Notts Derby Horse Show, we do say before the day and try to say to judges if we can keep costs very low due to running on a very tight bread line and for charity, though if a judge requires petrol or hotels, we pay for them before they come or on the day. No excuse not to be paid, our coursebuilder are not cheap THOUGH they stay all day, do a fab job and work very hard, you deserve to be paid or name and shame the shows If its one of mine i truly am sorry i presume all of ours have been paid out as forwarded it all on to treasuer and heard of no non payments x
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Post by bemused on Oct 27, 2009 11:12:39 GMT
Just asked my friend if she is still owed the money - which she is. It is £180 including supreme of show - and she hasn't had a penny. This show was qualification only, no entries on the day. So the organisers knew exactly what cash they had prior to show day - they could have warned folks. Is this legal?
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Post by LSC on Oct 27, 2009 13:21:07 GMT
Bemused its disgusting that shows do this. Where does the money go? Most shows have sponsored classes. I would be pretty cheesed off if i'd sponsored a class and the prize money not issued. I always make sure I have everything in writing ie pence per mile etc. Majority of shows are fantastic, always pay on the day and really look after their judges. Both of these shows are duratuion shows and should know better. I know one of them didnt pay up, last year! I was there for 4days and was given 1 drink ticket and 1meal ticket per day! I was 'on duty' from 8-5 on all 4 days. Is this really how you should treat people who have made a 300mile trip to judge for you? ?? As I'm typing, had a call from one of the shows concerned. Apparantly my cheque will be in the post today! Her words were, 'I dont want you naming us on horse gossip!!!!!' Lets hope the other one thinks the same, and pays what they owe.
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Post by CarolineNelson on Oct 27, 2009 13:21:28 GMT
I too, am waiting for Judges expenses from a show held in September.
Having answered a last-minute plea for help as they had no Judge for a particular section for some reason; both Geographically and Practically I went well out of my way to help, including locating and paying for my own accomodation, (as I was asked to do!) considerable additional fuel - and a whole extra day wasted.
On the day, I had to do considerably more than was anticipated in order to remain within the rules for the main Societies for whom I adjudicate and to ensure safety for the competitors.
Regarding the 'expenses' I have emailed both by PM and privately, to no avail.
Even a post-show thank-you would have been nice!
As my appointment was very last-minute, I did not have a schedule, however, a friend has given me the phone number, which I will also be trying. I would not have used this medium had not someone else started the thread - and I hate to beg, but I simply cannot afford to be out of pocket.
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Post by thecremellosociety on Oct 27, 2009 13:41:39 GMT
Ohhhh sounds like you rattled ones cage
(have no ideas which one but a threat of naming on horse gossip always generally brings them out the wood work ! had it with cheques bounced on show day at a charity show, came through letter box, with a card saying please dont name and shame !!!!!!)
Sometimes its the only way, it shouldnt happen and gives us all a bad name, we try very hard to keep our judges happy, well fed and well catered for ...... I am going to have a little gripe on here about judges bookings in a min.
I would give the others a week to reply or name and shame, you can pm me or email me on emma.rushton@ntlworld.com ( as a guest you may not be able to pm) and will see if i can help ....
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Post by CarolineNelson on Oct 27, 2009 14:38:54 GMT
EmmaJane - As you probably know, we run a super show up here and the Committee goes out of its way to make sure that everyone, Judges, Stewards, helpers, helpers helpers) have thanks and are well fed and watered throughout the day.
Likewise, my remit is to locate enough stabling and place our competitors on a suitable yard, never easy with no permenant boxes on or immediately adjacent to the showground.
Win or lose, wet or fine, we hope that everyone leaves the Showground feeling that they enjoyed the Show and, importantly, that they want to return the next year!
In todays climate, that is vital!
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Post by Tandy on Oct 27, 2009 14:54:33 GMT
this is so worrying, and when I have helped to organise shows in the past our judges have always had their expenses on the day of the show and I just presumed this was how all shows did it, bet its puting some people offgoing forward to judge.
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Post by poniesrus on Oct 27, 2009 16:19:49 GMT
Agree with Tandy. Our judges, some who travelled quite some distances and involved flights etc, were all paid their expenses either on the day or within a couple of weeks. Our judge covener contacted all our judges in writing 2 or 3 times to confirm their expenses, flights, hotels, etc etc.
It's quite worrying to hear of shows not paying out promised prize money and judges expenses. As far as the prize money is concerned, I would imagine that's actually unlawful !
Name and shame I say !!!!
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Post by donkeydo on Oct 27, 2009 19:07:02 GMT
We always pay all judges and stewards expences on the day. Saves any mistakes or oversights!
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Post by gypsy1 on Oct 27, 2009 19:38:55 GMT
Agree with donkeydo ,
We pay our judges on the day aswell as making sure they have lunch and normally a bottle of wine just to say an extra THANK YOU , it is hard to fiind judges so i do try to make it enjoyable for them too ..
NO JUDGES NO SHOWS ...
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Post by Balvenie on Oct 27, 2009 21:20:06 GMT
Donkeydo & Emmajane, you treat your judges brilliant. Always paid on the day/posted within a week. I dont have any restrictions to how far I will travel. I love judging and didnt go onto any panel just to do a 20 mile radius of home! Most of this year I have been going a min of 100 mile away from home.
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Post by agent on Oct 28, 2009 10:54:17 GMT
We always pay our judges on the day too - we send an expenses form with the schedule.
In response to the other similar thread about the same judges in the same areas - we have recently been trying to get judges for next years shows. We have tried to get some of the newer judges - for a change. Although some are very keen and helpful as with their slightly more experienced colleagues, we are faced with excused that make me wonder why they ever put themselves forward for panels. "Don't judge on Sundays" "wont go more than 2 hrs", "dont judge in the winter". So, those of you that complain about show organisers should try to get on the phone some time and book judges. It is the ones you see time and again that are always willing to help out, for little return, whatever the weather. And I say "Well done and Thank you so much".
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Post by bundle on Oct 28, 2009 13:42:13 GMT
We always pay our judges, coursebuilders and everyone else on the day - what excuse would a show have for not doing so?
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Post by Balvenie on Oct 28, 2009 18:52:09 GMT
We always pay our judges on the day too - we send an expenses form with the schedule. In response to the other similar thread about the same judges in the same areas - we have recently been trying to get judges for next years shows. We have tried to get some of the newer judges - for a change. Although some are very keen and helpful as with their slightly more experienced colleagues, we are faced with excused that make me wonder why they ever put themselves forward for panels. "Don't judge on Sundays" "wont go more than 2 hrs", "dont judge in the winter". So, those of you that complain about show organisers should try to get on the phone some time and book judges. It is the ones you see time and again that are always willing to help out, for little return, whatever the weather. And I say "Well done and Thank you so much". Agent I cant understand why people go onto panels, if they dont want to judge. I dont mind where I judge, what classes I do dont mind winter or summer. Only time I have to say no is when shows fall on my shifts, at work.
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Post by aphrodite on Oct 28, 2009 21:13:25 GMT
As I'm typing, had a call from one of the shows concerned. Apparantly my cheque will be in the post today! Her words were, 'I dont want you naming us on horse gossip!!!!!' Lets hope the other one thinks the same, and pays what they owe. An excellent result .... ;D
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Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2009 22:42:14 GMT
We pay our judges on the day too.
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Post by columbine on Oct 28, 2009 22:45:38 GMT
We pay judges, course builder, first aid etc on the day. Always the way we have done it.
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Post by Tandy on Oct 29, 2009 11:45:52 GMT
but has the cheque arrived, still think they should be named and shamed so that any future judges know to get their money up front or on the day of the show.
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Post by flair1 on Oct 29, 2009 21:21:13 GMT
There are many shows that think that a bottle of wine is accepable, after a whole days judging, but generally i have been paid well this season, but for those shows that only offer a bottle of wine, will be shocked next year when if they dont offer payment i will be charging a standard rate, after all it is a whole day im giving up. No one would go into work for nothing would they!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Post by hollycane on Oct 29, 2009 22:04:53 GMT
LSC I'm in a suspiciously similar situation having been told the cheque was "awaiting a 2nd signature", then "It was posted to you a month ago". This 3 months after the show. SHS very similar situation, last minute and a very long way to go indeed. Spent 6 hrs judging in the pouring rain then 4.5 hrs driving home....... I did last minute fill ins at 5 shows this last season and doubtless I will answer the same sorts of calls in good faith this season. I have ever before had and until this year have not usually actually asked for expenses but the price of fuel is so high I can't afford to be so far out of pocket either. I know running shows is a labour of love as is judging but my motto is now "Do as you would be done by" but I feel like I've been done! :-(
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Post by LSC on Oct 31, 2009 19:35:51 GMT
As I have sent more emails (and yes to the correct address), this week, and havent had a reply or a cheque perhaps this will work
ROYAL LONDON PLEASE PAY JUDGES EXPENSES.
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Post by iluvponies on Oct 31, 2009 19:47:56 GMT
As I have sent more emails (and yes to the correct address), this week, and havent had a reply or a cheque perhaps this will work ROYAL LONDON PLEASE PAY JUDGES EXPENSES. This is so disgraceful....if judges haven't even been paid expenses then what hope is there for us competitors who have asked for a refund....with vet cert as per rule 16 on conditions of entry.....we have emailed, rung, pm'd etc etc etc too many times to count....when we have got through or the phoes have been answered we are always promised payment. We have now given up and the matter is being pursued through the small claims court. I think it is a disgrace that a show takes your money and has not the decency to refund or in this case pay judges. I am only talking a few hundred £,s and yes not enough for a holiday ion blackpool but if this is being done to all competitors and judges, and also with anoether thread running on the same topic re money being taken but nothing coming in return then i feel RL must be holidaying in Barbados.... Royal London is it not time you Refund, Pay up and answer your Critics. RL is turning into a bit of scam....Disgraceful
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Post by cassie30 on Oct 31, 2009 21:47:47 GMT
Oh dear...maybe RL will come on and explain soon xx
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Post by thecremellosociety on Nov 1, 2009 9:15:42 GMT
Im sure this will be dealt with and is an oversight, never thought it would be R L, sure they will sort it out.
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Post by thecremellosociety on Nov 1, 2009 9:29:12 GMT
Having just spoken to Pat she is not aware of any outstanding judges fees, they are normally collected on the day, she hasnt had any phone calls or letters re judges fees and email is not 100% reliable, im sure if you telephone her on the number on the RL web page she will be happy to help !
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Post by Guestless on Nov 1, 2009 10:29:28 GMT
As I'm typing, had a call from one of the shows concerned. Apparantly my cheque will be in the post today! Her words were, 'I dont want you naming us on horse gossip!!!!!' ..and was this call from RL or the other show that also owes you?
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Post by LSC on Nov 1, 2009 12:12:12 GMT
As I'm typing, had a call from one of the shows concerned. Apparantly my cheque will be in the post today! Her words were, 'I dont want you naming us on horse gossip!!!!!' ..and was this call from RL or the other show that also owes you? It was from the other show. I haven't had any contact from RL at all. Emmajane, how can non payment of fees be an oversight?? Also, I dont feel it is down to anyone else to sort it out for them, no matter what your good intentions are. Why are you having to reply for them? It is easy to say noone has phoned, emailed etc (as for email account not working, all emails have shown as being read) I have given them more than enough time to forward what is owed- not just to me. I didnt take the decision to name on here lightly. This WAS the last resort.
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