Rude judging

[Angry Spectator]

Doesn't it really annoy you when a judge doesn't even watch a pony - it's just so rude. I accept that it has been a wet day and she probably wanted to get home, but surely everyone has a right to be looked at, as everyone pays the same entry.
Was watching some classes today and the judge turned her back on competitors doing their individual trot out and individual shows. In the championship that followed she even pulled her champion and reserve forward before the final pony had competed it's trot out in front of her.
Sorry to rant, but this sort of behaviour really annoys me.

[lolly]

We watched a coloured class at puk, and to be truthful i was discusted, there was about 16 in the class including some young children, the judge picked her first 10 then asked the other six to get in line.

When she got to the last of her favoured 10 she didnt even bother to ask the other six to do a show, just asked them to leave. All the money it costs the judge should have had the respect to watch them all, who is to say that one of the six wouldnt do a fantastic show and be moved up

It was the worst and rudest judging I have ever seen

[PUK Spectator]

The worst case of rudenes surely must have been the Large ISRT at PUK. Peter Emmersons pony was doing its show and the replacement judge was not watching 1 stride of it until it came to a halt directly in front of him. He had his back turned towards the confirmation judge all throughout its show.He was an extremely rude man.

[overatdaknee]

also had a Large ISRT at P (UK) and in one of the classes was amazed how its performance was marked as the performance judge watched about 1/8 th of the individual show, spent the time with back to it talking to the steward.............

[mollymoo]

Hi there

I was in that class and I agree!! I have never known anything like it, she chose her top ten inc one pony that had wrong legged it (it wasnt a novice class) and asked the rest to leave without seeing the conformation or anything. When I asked the steward for some feedback I was told "the judge won't discuss the class with competitors" How rude!!

[julie]

saw the same thing on the friday at nps summer champs, appalling, no excuse, maybe judges could be penalised by having their expenses cut down if they are found doing this!! Even worse was at local show on Sunday when judge for ring championship had little dots cantering around with big horses (kids only in FR's) - where are the standards eh?

[skint]

Each and every person pays the same money for entries and deserved to be watched. Its just so bad manners. I have seen the same as Julie said on many occasions at Local shows asking first riddens to canter around together. It just makes me wonder that judges just dont do their homework and should not really be judging at all.

At one local show last year we took our pony as he had been off for a few weeks and not shown and we needed to get a show in before PUK. He was a total nutter and went shocking he ended up winning his class and getting champion because the judge thought he was lovely and cute. I felt terrible and it wasnt fair to the other competitors he deserved to be at the bottom of the line after his escapades.

[julie]

I actually went on said show's website to say it was wrong (re getting FR's to canter around) and a reply came back from the ring steward to say that she and the judge had discussed it and the judge said ask them whether they want to do it or come in - this while they are trotting around, probably already phased by trying to remember diagonals and excited to be in a championship - now I ask you what kid worth its salt isnt going to say oh yes I can canter whilst their parents are praying for the opposite? I can't help feeling at times that judges bring most of the criticisms on themselves by thoughtless behaviour and yes I have done stewarding non aff and aff and the odd unaff judging but come on, it isnt rocket science at this level!

[dun4u]

I'll tell you a little (no, sorry, long) story:-

I was at a local show a few years ago, as a spectator (my youngster was arriving later) and couldn't believe that the Judge, a woman poss. in her late 20's was asking leading-reins to all trot around together ~ the Mums were absolutely knackered, and had the first-ridden all cantering together in the go-round. A parent standing close to me was aghast and we discussed the apparent ignorance of the judge. A rather hoity woman sitting in a Range-Rover next to us had overheard us and became very angry because the Judge was her daughter, and, in her words, 'has qualifications and certificates' to prove her capability. I'm afraid I had a big stand-up row with the woman even though I didn't have anything in the ring at the time I felt I had to stick up for what I (and quite a few others) believed to be right.

Imagine my horror when I discovered she (the mother) was due to Judge my pony's class in the afternoon!!! I kept well out of the way and didn't go near my friend who was handling it so she wouldn't put two and two together. I was so pleased when she put my pony first and as I went to congratulate them both she came storming up to me and said 'I hope you were satisfied with MY judging of that class'.

I took great delight in telling her it was my pony and she was gob-smacked!!! Needless to say, we didn't stay for the championship!!!

[gurnos]

The worst I have ever experienced was at a very well known Welsh show, the judge shouldn't have actually been judging for a start as she was not on the panel. Only 3 came forward to my class. It was my stallions 2nd ridden show and had only been broken a short while. While we were doing our individuals, the judge was looking at a dun horse in the collecting ring! 1st horse went well, 2nd horse was a bit overcooked and very on its toes and mine went well but a bit novicey and sluggish. She apologised to the 2nd horse for putting it 2nd as she new the rider, and didn't offer any advice to which I ffelt she could have being such a small class.

[manicblonde]

We had a supreme chamionship at a local show that we were 'fortunate' enough to take part in where the 'judge' wore a T shirt & flat cap (not a good start) watched the ridden pony walk away and trot back and then turned his back to look at the line up whilst she did her show! Talk about Rude Judging! More like Didn't have a clue what he was doing!!!

[jj]

went to local show only to find judge judgeing class put up pony they had sold and also took on to champion and thats a well know judge who also competes, and is quick to give out when faces are placed. as they say what goes around comes around.

[visitor]

Talk about rude judging at a certain Chaps championship show the stewards may well of done some of the judging. In One of the championship the seven judges discussed their findings and who was who rather than on a points system. Think its about time all classes are marked on a points system and displayed after each class for all to see. Not everyone knows they can request their marks.

[shelleyj]

Had a corker a couple of years ago, daughter in class, was pulled 3rd, Judges comments were as follows
"I know you, you're first, I know you. you're second, i don't know you, you're third!"
Don't you just love showing?

[ponygirlscot]

Rude judging we were at a show the other week there when it was the same judge for workers as it was for novice ridden the judge that was judging stood chatting most of the time to his steward while the riders were going round the ring looked like to me he wasnt interested on what was happening

[dun4u]

I have often seen Judges turn their backs on competitors before they have stopped and saluted at the end of their show. This is so very rude and shows a lack of basic manners - very disappointing for little ones in leading-rein classes who have been practicing for hours.

[a disgruntled competitor]

I bought a horse off a judge/producer,how come that i cant go in classes that they are judging,but their best friends can ??
Is this not the same biased judging??

and how come officials of the CHAPS assoc. can then have their close family compete in these CHAPS classes,when they are openly seen to be rubbiing upto the judges,especially at HOYS,surely this is bad practice,as it doesn't appear to be a fair game !!!

Surely we need to show that the competitions are fair for everyone,and the results are not decided before we even enter the ring

[thecremellosociety]

Its hard to judge people who you know, but on a day i am judging and when i enter the ring, i act totally fairly, no matter who is in there, thats the way it should be.

Its happened recently but the person in question had absolutly the best animal on the day. I give everyone 100% of my attention as i am doing a job and every pays the same and deserves the same attention ,BUT we all know this doesnt happen always, and whislt showing is a judges opnion, on what is best on that day, we all love our animals and like them to do well, but you are asking a judge to place you in order of merit, and while we do that there will be people out there think that they deserve higher placings etc, you will never please everyone.

[disgruntled competitor]

dear cremmelosociety ,you obviously couldnt sleep!!! ;D

i' m afraid i disagree with you ,ref judging people you have connections with.It is human nature to favour those that you know or are associated with,it is also possible that the ponies etc are more known to them,this all creates bias,and is unfair to others.
If there are any connections between judge and competitor,it is not a fair game to other entrants.
This also applies to officials of shows that are then competing,especially at higher level shows.
one judge said to me,that if a certain producer rode a real 'minger' she would still get her qualification!!!! ie HOYS
After all we all have the same expenses !!

[shelleyj]

to be honest, daughter has had lessons with some very good people who judge. I wouldn't out her under them because if she was placed their integrity would be questioned and that isn't fair - however I have no doubt that they would be more critical of her and her pony than they might be of others!!!

[OMG100]

disgruntled said:

dear cremmelosociety ,you obviously couldnt sleep!!! ;D

i' m afraid i disagree with you ,ref judging people you have connections with.It is human nature to favour those that you know or are associated with,it is also possible that the ponies etc are more known to them,this all creates bias,and is unfair to others.
If there are any connections between judge and competitor,it is not a fair game to other entrants.
This also applies to officials of shows that are then competing,especially at higher level shows.
one judge said to me,that if a certain producer rode a real 'minger' she would still get her qualification!!!! ie HOYS
After all we all have the same expenses !!

Totally agree with all the above, and with regards cremellosociety I remember not so long ago you posting threads on here looking for advise on your pony and your replies and behaviour being that of a true novice/amateur, when people give true reports back you attacked them, also you requested advice on how your child looked in his riding clothes which again everyone replied with honest opinions and they were attacked yet again. i'e the jackets to grow into?, he won't wear tight jods?, you liked the pony club hat? I could go on and on........and to my horror and obviously others you JUDGE at a show...........and then to make matters even worse you judge your friends.......God forbid

I'm really not surprised your karma's plummit like they do and after being gifted 150 you've even managed to loose them, don't tell me theres only one or two people smiting you there must be an awful lot more who are like me concerned.

[thecremellosociety]

Guest again under a disguise, i didnt not judge my friend they are aquanitainces, that i know through showing and running my shows alone, if youhad the balls to show your face rather than hiding behind a guests name then maybe i would listen to you, there are always 1 or 2 or 22 people that wont like the fact I speak my mind and do what i want to do and am NOT a sheep and follow the crowd ......... With re my judging capabilities, i have had no complaints over the classes i do and just because i prefer my boy in more tasteful and not loud and over the top outfits and prefer to have fun as nothing to do with my capabilities of judging in hand classes as i have a good knowlege of conformation and type, noone knows where i have been or what i have done and who i have worked with since i left school at 16, but then again im not going to read you my CV on here particularly as you dont come out from behind you mask making comments. If you are concerned about my capabilities and i so happen to be judging, easy peasy, dont come under me, BUT you cannot judge my honesty and i will place what is the best animal on the day, how it should be and not who is on the end of the string !

[thecremellosociety]

OHHH so you obviously missed the post where i bought him a new outfit, and thanked all the helpful people for there comments ......... need to move your mask it slipped over your eyes a little and you cant see !!!!!!!!!!

[halfpass]

I have tried not to get involved in this, just reading the posts, but keep my very large gobb shut I no longer can. All you hear about is bad or rude judges, not once do we judges ever start a tread on bad or rude competitors and by god over the years I've seen my fair share as most others can confirm, over the years manners in the showring have declined, such small niceties such as a thank you when handed a rosette no matter what color.
what a lot of people forget is that we give up a lot of our spare time to judge if we are lucky we may get expenses but if it is a charity show most of us don't except and donate it to the Charity. lots of us have a vast wealth of experience of working and or competing on a wide variety of different types of horses and the experience we have gained we are quiet happy to impart that knowledge on to others, perhaps some competitors need to look to themselves and treat the judge to a few manners and maybe you may get a more positive response because quiet frankly you can stuff judging I don't need the hassle and I'm turning more and more invitations down as I really don't need the hassle, and more and more of my fellow judges feel the same, that will stuff you up when their is no one to show your horses and ponies to.
Sorry if this offends but it seems to me that judge bashing has become a national pastime, and if I started a thread on rude competitors I could fill a few pages on my own

[Milliesmum]

See Stuart Hollings column in this weeks H&H. It just seems that kids aren't brought up to have respect and good manners any more, and a lot of adults aren't setting as good an example as they ought!! And I don't just mean in the showing world. I hope I pull my kids up pretty sharply if they forget their manners or are rude to an adult, but I don't think all parents are the same, sadly.

Gone are the days when you accepted defeat with good grace and vowed to try harder next time!!

[thecremellosociety]

All i can say is that i take very minimum expenses from riding clubs just to cover diesil if quite a way away, i took nothing at the weekend as the secretary helps me and never asks for expenses. I have been asked by approx 12 riding clubs/ one off shows to judge within a 100 mile radius of my home, i have removed my details from the judges diary and turned everything down for 2008 due to wanting to do more myself, Lots of riding clubs are having MAJOR problems booking judges due to the rudeness of the competitors at times, and the few are ruining it for the many as soon noone will want to judge. I judge everybody fairly 100% of the time, i wouldnt have people trying to book me for 2009 already if i didnt !!! I had ago on another website about judge bashing, and predicting what they will like and only turning out if its the right juge for type, this week i have spoken to a number of people over a variety of things ranging from cremello society, to judges appointments and various others and have got talking about the difficulties faced booking judges due to disgruntled competitors and internet judge bashing, its a sad fact that i cant forsee in 20 years time very few judges, i mean i for one wonder is it worth subjecting yourself to it ??

Can people not just be happy and have a good time rather than stiring and poisoning the atmosphere. I have been disgruntled on occasion where it has been blantenly obvious that i was placed where i was as a gelding in a breed class, i did ask but wasnt rude and left the ring with a smile and wrote it off as i wouldnt go under that judge with the pony i currently had again, but would maybe try with something different, after all it was just his opnion and have been up the top and lower down the line and you pays your money you take your chance. Think you have to be honest with what you have, i love my pony to pieces and he fulfils the needs i wanted and bought him for, i think hes a pretty good example of his breed type but he will never be everyones cup of tea, with some activly really liking him and praising him and others not, i wont bash them for having an opnion.

My Children will learn to smile on all occasions and be gracious in winnning and in defeat, and will congratulate other in the line weather above or below us.

At the end of the day its a hobby, and if we get a rosette and we enjoy it thats what matters, and if we pick up some good placings on the day then all the better.

I really hate the way the world is going at the moment, everybody is out for themselves and ready to stab people in the back, with the post that says i had "attacked" people back, i think if re read in the context it was meant, i was merley asking why ?? and should ?? not attacking people on a personal level but intrigued to know how they got to the reasonings they had.

With recent events here with my daughter being bullied, our window being smashed by bullies, and now the school being vandalised and mini bus set on fire by these bullies, the world worries me. I intend to have fun and bring my children up with respect, if more people were happy and pleased for others and less inclined to moan and just get on with it, i think the world particularly the showing world would be a nicer place.

I have met some great people through running the shows HP included who was a massive support to my daughter at a recent show, and meeting back up with millies mum, who had a pony at the yeard when i got my first pony age 9 !!!! I just wish people could be nicer, maybe its just a dog eat dog world, and i am niave, but i will do my best to run the shows i run to the 110% best of my ability, even though it does take its toll and is exceptionally hard work and you get very little thanks for it, (its lovley to have people come and tell us they had a great day and also hints to improve, i think you will find where our shows are related we try to accomadate you all )

[STUD MUFFIN]

Dear mrs Cremello society
I think you have missed the point about the judging.This is not 'judge-bashing', this is high level competitors that spend considerable time and expense,going all over the country,to pursue their sport.What we ask for is rules that provide FAIR judging for all!!!!
This is not always happening.
As for someone hiding behind a mask !!! Mrs Cremello??
Obviously if we give our names we'll never qualify for HOYS again !!!! EVER !!!!

[halfpass]

rubbish you only have to look on this site to see that the judge is normally wrong because they didn't place so and so, it is never that there was something better in the ring, at the end of the day judging is subjective it is one persons opinion it may not be yours or someone Else's but it is their's and therefore they should not be slated on the Internet, if you don't like the way a person judges a class the don't enter under them again it is your decision.
the more rules that you put in place the more ways people will find ways to bend them, judges and competitors alike if you are so inclined, the only thing that you can rely on is integrity of the judge and the competitor to make sure of fair play, if you see any blatant infringement of the rules why not put your money down and complain to the secretary on the day not wait till you get home and slate people on here or other sites.judging is a thankless task and you will only ever please one person and thats the person you give the first rosette to

[stephjw1]

Blimey some of the people on here are quite rude, I have shown under rude judges but would never slag them off, just chalk it up to experience.
I have done some stewarding and hve been asked to judge but have always refused I think it is a thankless task you will never please everybody so I salute judges for giving up their time.
Actually I forgot I judged a charity fancy dress I have never been more nervous it was soooo hard!!!!!!!!!! and im still not sure whether or not I got it right

[halfpass]

thats exactly why I will not do affiliated anymore I just do a few riding club shows were the competitors are just having a good time and everybody seems to be enjoying themselves, and also you are able to spend time and give advice if it is asked and not made to feel that you have to have the car engine running ready for the moment you leave the ring